At 6/14/08 12:10 PM, pepeatumi wrote: Booker T was retooled... And he feuded with HHH in a feud that was all about race, and how Booker T was better served as the guy that cleaned HHH's shoes and drove his limo instead of as the guy who should challenge him for the belt.

Agreed the storyline was horrible, but again, I don't think that means Vince is a racist. I think when Vince does something like that he just goes "that'll make some controversy!" if Vince didn't have any love for black people, would Hayes have gotten 60 days for drinking and dropping an N-Bomb?

By the way, someone had to OK that whole storyline, and it was probably Vince. Booker was then given the King gimmick, which supposed to be over the top and preposterous because it was a black dude portaying a king. The Rock was pushed, but being a 3rd generation superstar helped. The fact that Rocky was also a mercurial talent that could NOT be denied also helps.

True, but still, he was pushed right out of the blocks to the moon.

Mark Henry.. You mean the dude that's called a SILVERBACK?

I mean go back to when he started, he was pushed to the moon and they had major major plans for him. If you don't like black people, why give this guy a million dollar contract and plan for him to be a top star?

The thing with Henry was that when he came to the WWE he was an olympic athlete and was the type of person Vince liked. Big, strong and a weight lifter. A lot of you may not know this, but Vince tried to start a weight lifing federation to coinside with his wrestling fed. Vince has always loved that sport, so if you ever wonder why the muscle heads get pused over someone with more talent, there's why.

Anyway Vince wanted to make sure Henry stayed with the company since he had full intention of pushing him since he figured that fans would want to see an american olympion in action. So he signed him to a ten year deal with a huge sum of money. But as you all knoiw it never really worked out for Henry as he wasn't nearly as good as Vince had hoped, and when Stone Cold got popular they knew where to focus their attention. There is some of this story in Mick Foley's first book.

To be perfectly honest Henry has improved his game. He at least trys in there and has done some cool stuff, like when he did a splash onto the announcers table. I'd watch Henry over Khali any day of the week.

I have to ask this... What are the odds that the Carlito thing is a work? I know, I know. We can't really expect WWE to do something like this, but its something to think about.

My guess is that it's not a work and Carlito is looking to get fired so he can leave. It's a damn shame too since hes a very talented wrestler that WWE could really use. I was under the impression that he and a bunch of other second generation wrestlers would join Ted Jr. in a stable.

At 6/15/08 06:49 PM, Outlaw88 wrote: My guess is that it's not a work and Carlito is looking to get fired so he can leave. It's a damn shame too since hes a very talented wrestler that WWE could really use. I was under the impression that he and a bunch of other second generation wrestlers would join Ted Jr. in a stable.

That's why I think that it might be a work. A 2nd generation superstar calling out a veteran who's been accused in the past of "holding people down".

Let's remember, people where pretty damn sure that Matt Hardy attacking Edge at random a couple of years back was a shoot... It turned out to be a work (Based on a real life incident, that is). I'm just saying, this wouldn't be the first time that the WWE uses the dirtsheets to their advantage.

The situation with Matt Hardy and Edge is different. When Matt attacked Edge WWE had re-signed him and put him in that program. They really had no choice since the fans were all over Edge and WWE with anger that they fired Matt. WWE would have also been fools if they passed up a storyline that fans wanted to see in real life happen.

At 6/15/08 11:32 PM, Outlaw88 wrote: The situation with Matt Hardy and Edge is different. When Matt attacked Edge WWE had re-signed him and put him in that program. They really had no choice since the fans were all over Edge and WWE with anger that they fired Matt. WWE would have also been fools if they passed up a storyline that fans wanted to see in real life happen.

But then they totally fucked it up by making the feud totally one sided and burying Hardy!

I don't think it's impossible this is a work, hell that's always possible, but I think it's unlikely. Carlito has been somebody WWE has been unhappy with quite a bit in the past, and yeah, I can't really get behind this as a work for the same reason I can't get behind George Bush being behind 9/11: They just aren't smart enough to create a situation like this and then execute it.

I hope they handle the giveaway better tonight. Last weeks show wasn't very good so this time they had better step up. I mena the whole reason for this is to get ratings, but you need good matches and stuff to really make it, not the billion to one chance of winning money.

I'm looking forward to RAW, simply to see what they do with HHH/Cena/Hardy. I'm literally praying that they add him into the match at NoC, despite him not having a hope in hell of winning it. Just to make the match slightly more interesting.

At 6/16/08 05:23 PM, MudkipsPiano wrote: And if they keep doing this I'm going to stop watching RAW. Dead serious.

That's the best way to make them change their tactics. I heard the idea was to "make the segments funnier" good look there WWE.

So...after showing that hey, they actually have a decent women's division now, we get everybody in a bikini contest!!! Yay!!! I like looking at hot women as much as the next guy but...way to make the girls not seem serious.

Lance Cade? Kind of a random choice. At least they have found something for him to do, I expected him to get lost in the shuffle. That spinebuster-type move he did on Cena was cool.

At 6/17/08 02:48 AM, boloneyman wrote: Lance Cade? Kind of a random choice.

No more random then starting to feature Charlie Haas out of nowhere. Who's dick did he all of a sudden suck?

Raw was ok last night. They kept the giveway much shorter and direct this time so it went by faster. I agree that seeing Cade all of a sudden go after HHH was weird and random. Same thing with Haas getting used out of the blue.

One of my favorite matches of the night was Jeff Hardy vs. Carlito. Both guys got to show off some really good offense. The main event was good too right up until the DQ finish.

Who do you think Jericho will defend the IC belt against? My bet is either Jeff Hardy or HBK.

You know.. I don't care how random Cade attacking HHH or Haas hosting a bikini contest was. At least it was something different. We didn't get Jeff Hardy, Orton, HHH or Cena standing tall as RAW ended (Something that seems to happen every week). We got Jericho and Cade, again, something DIFFERENT!

Besides, this could be a good angle if they play up how Cade was trained by HBK. Maybe he was dissapointed by what his trainer has become, and he's decided to join up with the man who he thinks is right (Jericho).

Again, is it random? HELL YES! Did you expect it to happen? Probably not. We always complain about getting the same old shit, they try for something new, and we're going to complain about this too?

Good points everybody. I'm all for letting the seldom seen guys get sime air time. Haas and Cade both have some pretty good potential. Maybe not ME potential, but I say that could change.

At 6/17/08 10:58 AM, pepeatumi wrote: and we're going to complain about this too?

I am. Lance fucking Cade?
I'm all for new and different stuff, but for the love of fuck, please at least build the guy a little beforehand. E.G, forget Cade for now, why dosen't CM Punk come out and help Jericho? Heel turn, something to do rather than loosing every other week. Or Hardy? Based on what happened last week. Even Shelton Benjamin would have been better than Cade, who appears to have got the job simply because he was spare and available...

At 6/17/08 04:02 PM, DannyIsOnFire wrote: I am. Lance fucking Cade?
I'm all for new and different stuff, but for the love of fuck, please at least build the guy a little beforehand. E.G, forget Cade for now, why dosen't CM Punk come out and help Jericho? Heel turn, something to do rather than loosing every other week. Or Hardy? Based on what happened last week. Even Shelton Benjamin would have been better than Cade, who appears to have got the job simply because he was spare and available...

Punk and Shelton are on ECW (And they're not liked by the higher-ups) so it would have made less sense for them to help Jericho. Again, if they play up that Cade trained under HBK, then they have a chance at making this work. At the very least, give them a chance to see where they go with this. If Cade is drafted to SD next week, then feel free to get pissed because it would truly mean that this was a waste of time.

For what its worth, word is that RAW scored a 3.3 in the ratings... It seems they did SOMETHING right.

Agreed about what was said about Punk. Look, if your having a draft the next week, nobody should be switching brands this week, and I think it's fine to try and elevate somebody, as long as Cade isn't headlining tomorrow and being given the belt, the fuck is the harm? He could get great rub here and he could maybe open some eyes. I am hoping for Punk to be moved in the draft and then ultimately turn heel since I think he would be fantastic there and it's the only way he can turn heads in the office.

3.3 still isn't that good. Smackdown should be doing that rating.
Though I guess they'll just give the million dollar give-away credit for the boost in ratings and go back to mediocre booking the following weeks and keep the give-away.

At 6/17/08 10:23 PM, HeartbreakHoldout wrote: 3.3 still isn't that good. Smackdown should be doing that rating.

Agreed, it's pretty much them going back up to the ceiling of what they've been doing lately. Ratings are down across the board for TV though, still, WWE could be doing what every other show should be trying to do: improve the programming top to bottom to make it "can't miss" for people again.

At 6/17/08 10:56 PM, aviewaskewed wrote: Agreed, it's pretty much them going back up to the ceiling of what they've been doing lately. Ratings are down across the board for TV though, still, WWE could be doing what every other show should be trying to do: improve the programming top to bottom to make it "can't miss" for people again.

Well, there's a bad creative process, bad ratings, and worse ratings than when they had better creative.
I think they could at least be at the high 3's, low 4's with Raw, especially with all the starpower they cram onto there.
They could say there are no stars along the lines of the Rock or Austin (or Hogan) in the business right now, but that's all the fault of the creative not consistently creating big stars. Rock was never an amazing performer, but he was booked to his advantages. Cena could be booked to be a badass tweener face (who gets to write his own stuff on the mic), CM Punk could be as big as Bret, who knows.
They definately need to make the most of what they have.

At 6/17/08 11:22 PM, HeartbreakHoldout wrote: They definately need to make the most of what they have.

Agreed, the biggest problem I see is they continue to focus on the guys who have been big for the last ten years or better now. People have seen those guys over and over for 10 years, time to start phasing them down, or recognize that they can be in matches that aren't the focus of the show and carrying the belts. Build up some of your younger guys, they might not be Austin, or Rock, or Hogan, but those kinds of performers are special and only come along every once in awhile. There are guys on that roster though who could easily be to the company what a Shawn Michaels or a Bret Hart is. A solid draw until big business happens again.

I thought ECW was enjoyable last night. It was my first time seeing Bourne in action so I was impressed with that. Been a long time since I saw a shooting star press.

Punk got a great win last night over Morrison as well so all was good. The only downside is that the tag match between Miz/Morrison vs. Finley/Hornswaggle is now official...I really hope they don't win the belts.

One wrestler definitely not changing brands is Shawn Michaels. Michaels regularly attends Wednesday morning church services back home. Michaels doesn't like working Tuesday night shows, which is why he isn't moving to SmackDown, and probably never will.

At 6/18/08 08:33 PM, idiot-buster wrote: One wrestler definitely not changing brands is Shawn Michaels. Michaels regularly attends Wednesday morning church services back home. Michaels doesn't like working Tuesday night shows, which is why he isn't moving to SmackDown, and probably never will.

He dosen't like working Tuesdays because he never wants to be off the "A" show. Yeah, Michaels has matured a lot, but there's still just a touch of the old Shawn in there too.

At 6/17/08 10:56 PM, aviewaskewed wrote:

At 6/17/08 10:23 PM, HeartbreakHoldout wrote: 3.3 still isn't that good. Smackdown should be doing that rating.

Agreed, it's pretty much them going back up to the ceiling of what they've been doing lately. Ratings are down across the board for TV though, still, WWE could be doing what every other show should be trying to do: improve the programming top to bottom to make it "can't miss" for people again.

I can honestly say this is the longest Ive ever seen wrestling blow.

I purposely missed the last 2 raws cus I knew they were gonna be pieces of shit. And from the comments, it looks like I was 110% right. To have the option to go get hammered with a bunch of friends at the karaoke bar or watch a show thats the equivalent to sunday night heat back in the late 90s (SRSLY, Hardy Boyz had AWESOME SPOTS on SNH back then) isnt even really a choice. Id rather be drunk of guiness singin "Lady Madonna" by the beatles badly.

I tend to look forward to the draft just to try and come up with new fueds and rivalries for those who got moved around. I just hope SD doesn't get raped like it did last time. ECW also runs that risk if they decide to move Kofi, Punk and Benjamin.

At 6/19/08 08:29 AM, Outlaw88 wrote: I tend to look forward to the draft just to try and come up with new fueds and rivalries for those who got moved around. I just hope SD doesn't get raped like it did last time. ECW also runs that risk if they decide to move Kofi, Punk and Benjamin.

Punk I see moving but Kofi and Benjamin will probably stay I reckon.

i can't wait for the draft i wanna know what happens if HHH gets drafted to smackdown that would suck.

Hey! I used to post in this club alot under the account MCU.
I have made this new account, but I just want to let you know, I've stopped watching wrestling some how.
I didn't really notice but I never watch it anymore.
Can someone tell me, is it worth watching and getting involved with this club again?