At 2/10/09 08:45 AM, MrTrivia wrote: I've noticed a trend in the video game industry. It seems nowadays there are a lot of games coming out with "RPG elements". For example, Mass Effect and Fallout 3 both blur the line between RPG and Shooter. What's your opinion on cross-genre games like these?

awesome games.

At 2/10/09 08:45 AM, MrTrivia wrote: I've noticed a trend in the video game industry. It seems nowadays there are a lot of games coming out with "RPG elements". For example, Mass Effect and Fallout 3 both blur the line between RPG and Shooter. What's your opinion on cross-genre games like these?

Personally, I like it. They're bringing RPGs back little by little into the public eye. And that's a good thing.

Still too many people who think JRPGs are for children, though. And too many shooter fans.

DNND is SO right!

At 2/10/09 06:00 PM, masterofkoolness wrote: DNND is SO right!

Thanks. I try.

At 2/10/09 08:45 AM, MrTrivia wrote: I've noticed a trend in the video game industry. It seems nowadays there are a lot of games coming out with "RPG elements". For example, Mass Effect and Fallout 3 both blur the line between RPG and Shooter. What's your opinion on cross-genre games like these?

I think it's questionably prejudice against JRPGs.
Everyone these days bash on JRPGs because of their consistency, then use that anti-jap bias for propaganda for their games, that are just labeled rpgs because they have rpg elements.
If Fallout 3 is an rpg, then by that same logic, Sonic Unleashed (360/PS3) is an rpg too, yet it is not acknowledged as one.
People just slap on the title "rpg" because the games are American developed and is also a shooting game--which is baffling on why people aren't tired of them yet.
They bore of Japanese rps, because there is always a sword user, but they incessanty meat ride shooting games, because of their innovation.

<sarcasm>Because JRPGs never bring anything new to the table</sarcasm>

At 2/10/09 10:37 PM, knuxrouge wrote: I think it's questionably prejudice against JRPGs.

What he said.

All of it.

At 2/10/09 10:37 PM, knuxrouge wrote:

At 2/10/09 08:45 AM, MrTrivia wrote: I've noticed a trend in the video game industry. It seems nowadays there are a lot of games coming out with "RPG elements". For example, Mass Effect and Fallout 3 both blur the line between RPG and Shooter. What's your opinion on cross-genre games like these?

I think it's questionably prejudice against JRPGs.
Everyone these days bash on JRPGs because of their consistency, then use that anti-jap bias for propaganda for their games, that are just labeled rpgs because they have rpg elements.
If Fallout 3 is an rpg, then by that same logic, Sonic Unleashed (360/PS3) is an rpg too, yet it is not acknowledged as one.
People just slap on the title "rpg" because the games are American developed and is also a shooting game--which is baffling on why people aren't tired of them yet.
They bore of Japanese rps, because there is always a sword user, but they incessanty meat ride shooting games, because of their innovation.

<sarcasm>Because JRPGs never bring anything new to the table</sarcasm>

Actually, I think you summed it up quite well. There are tons of fighting games with nothing necessarily added to them except for graphics. Ex. CoD:WaW - Another graphically pumped WW2 game with the same gameplay mechanics as all the other WW2 shooters... yet people are still dazzled and amazed when a new one is released.

RPGs/JRPGs are somewhat stuck in the same situation. Unless there is an significant difference from other RPGs, no one seems to care for new ones. For example, the new FFXIII. Although the FF series is already popular as it is, people are amazingly surprized of the new "Real-Time" system, and tons of people will buy the "Real-Time" one over the "Turn Based" one. To many, interactivity is an important feature in video games, let along RPGs/JRPGs.

At 2/10/09 10:37 PM, knuxrouge wrote: They bore of Japanese rps, because there is always a sword user, but they incessanty meat ride shooting games, because of their innovation.

Well, I certainly get tired of the sword using main character cliché, especially in games where guns are in common use.

Why use a sword to battle evil with when you can use a gun? What possible reason?

It's silly is what it is.

If we're going to have main characters use archaic weapons (or indeed, ridiculous modern updates on archaic weapons), why not make them interesting ones?

Like, say, a large stick. With some nails in it. Rusty nails.

Or maybe a mace that instead of a ball on the end, has a small lion. One that shoots fire ants. And the fire ants are literally on fire. Also, the fire's blue.

I should be a game designer.

At 2/10/09 11:38 PM, Kuro wrote:

Or maybe a mace that instead of a ball on the end, has a small lion. One that shoots fire ants. And the fire ants are literally on fire. Also, the fire's blue.

I should be a game designer.

That stuff is gold. A fighting game with such unique weapons would be a win in any case.
A gun that shoots shurikens and lightning from Haze is the closest you can get to that.

At 2/11/09 12:01 AM, ikool wrote: A gun that shoots shurikens and lightning from Painkiller is the closest you can get to that.

I'm sorry. Yahtzee made me do it.

At 2/11/09 12:13 AM, DeathNoteetoNhtaeD wrote:

At 2/11/09 12:01 AM, ikool wrote: A gun that shoots shurikens and lightning from Painkiller is the closest you can get to that.

I'm sorry. Yahtzee made me do it.

None taken, I always seem to mess up quotes no matter how well I try to do them XD.
Well... I can't wait till the release of Mario&Luigi RPG 3. The videos are delicious and its being released in Japan on Thursday =D

At 2/10/09 11:38 PM, Kuro wrote:

At 2/10/09 10:37 PM, knuxrouge wrote: They bore of Japanese rps, because there is always a sword user, but they incessanty meat ride shooting games, because of their innovation.

Because swords are more traditional, and offer more options for bases of special attacks, with swords, there are many styles to assume and many ways to use one, with a gun, you just shoot....

I should be a game designer

I'm going to be one, one of my many life goals.

At 2/11/09 03:55 AM, knuxrouge wrote: with a gun, you just shoot....

Pistol, shotgun, machine gun, sniper rifle, rocket launcher...

Do you think that these are all shot in the same way? You could just as easily say 'with a sword, you just chop'.

That last statement is especially true in RPGs, though, considering how little you control your character's movements in battle (usually).

At 2/11/09 05:36 AM, Kuro wrote:

At 2/11/09 03:55 AM, knuxrouge wrote: with a gun, you just shoot....

Pistol, shotgun, machine gun, sniper rifle, rocket launcher...

Do you think that these are all shot in the same way?

They all shoot, don't they?
There is a barrel, and a trigger, right?

You could just as easily say 'with a sword, you just chop'.

Not really, there are hundreds of martial art styles that all involve a unique use of a sword--thats what I meant in the first place.
For example, a rapier does not 'chop', it stabs.
A katana doesn't 'chop' it slices, I'm not being technical here either, the sheer power needed to chop is not supported in the thin construction of a katana, it can be used to chop, but that's not it's purpose.
A halberd chops, a giant heavy weapon like that serves no better use than relying on it's weight to chop through things.
With a gun, you just shoot.
Different gun, but like the rest, it shoots.
A better comparison would rather be naming other types of swords, seeing how you named other types of guns.
However you do hold some truth.
A sword is a sharp weapon meant to pierce through skin/armor in some fashion, just like how a gun is to fire rounds of ammo at a mid or relatively long distance.
You see they're both similar, for having one particular trait that is their own.
My issue is that people (namely Americans) got tired of swords, because they were all the same, and are craving about gun, when these too, are pretty much the same.
If you get bored with swords, then thats cool, your opinion, not my place to fuck with it, but have reason for it, good reason.
This isn't a "good" reason.

whats mario and luigi 3 coming out for?hope its for the DS!

At 2/11/09 07:01 AM, knuxrouge wrote: A better comparison would rather be naming other types of swords, seeing how you named other types of guns.

But that would have missed my point.

I was just saying that there's plenty of different ways to use a gun, and you could just as easily pigeonhole a sword into one simple action as you did guns.

Also, there's plenty of different 'styles' to shooting a gun. Like say... You could hold a gun sideways.

I think my main point is: Valkyria Chronicles is an awesome game.

At 2/11/09 04:52 PM, Kuro wrote: Also, there's plenty of different 'styles' to shooting a gun. Like say... You could hold a gun sideways.

I laughed when I read this.

At 2/11/09 10:11 PM, knuxrouge wrote:

At 2/11/09 04:52 PM, Kuro wrote: Also, there's plenty of different 'styles' to shooting a gun. Like say... You could hold a gun sideways.

I laughed when I read this.

Yeah. My take on this is there is numerous ways to kill a person with different types of swords, but only one way to kill someone with every gun. What I mean is that you can stab, slice, slit, chop, and garrotte with a sword, but you can shoot someone with a gun. Sure, you can hold a gun in a different position, but that's not really changing how you kill someone, is it?

At 2/11/09 10:11 PM, knuxrouge wrote: I laughed when I read this.

I am glad my jokes are appreciated.

At 2/11/09 10:55 PM, DeathNoteetoNhtaeD wrote:

At 2/11/09 10:11 PM, knuxrouge wrote:

At 2/11/09 04:52 PM, Kuro wrote: Also, there's plenty of different 'styles' to shooting a gun. Like say... You could hold a gun sideways.

I laughed when I read this.

Yeah. My take on this is there is numerous ways to kill a person with different types of swords, but only one way to kill someone with every gun. What I mean is that you can stab, slice, slit, chop, and garrotte with a sword, but you can shoot someone with a gun. Sure, you can hold a gun in a different position, but that's not really changing how you kill someone, is it?

But each gun has its own particular usefulness. For example, if you need a headshot from a mile away, you have to use a high-power sniper rifle because nothing else will do. If you're in very close range, you use a pistol. If you're aiming at a very elusive target, you may need a shotgun loaded with buckshot or birdshot that spreads out along the trajectory.

At 2/12/09 07:56 AM, MrTrivia wrote: If you're aiming at a very elusive target, you may need a shotgun loaded with buckshot or birdshot that spreads out along the trajectory.

Or just grab a RL/GL/Grenade if it's on the ground. AOE for the win :p

Exactly what an RPG is has kinda become blurred lately. To me, If I have Character level I can lvl up, Stats I can lvl up, and maybe Skills i can lvl up, with infinitely spawning enemies, and a world map with dungeons, I consider it an RPG.
Fallout 3 is a good example. It as all those elements. However, it also has the FPS element that people complain about, which I honestly don't see why they do. There is the V.A.T.S. system that you never have to fire a single shot/take a single melee swing outside of if you don't wish to. Not to mention there's Jet, which replenishes your AP - hey! AP, another RPG term we know! :D - to a certain extent, and at lvl 20 you get a skill which replenishes it fully every time you get a kill in V.A.T.S.
Of course, you never have to fire a shot IN V.A.T.S., either, if you don't want to.
Though, if you really MUST make it more RPG-like, there ARE a couple of swords in the game you can get :p

At 2/12/09 07:56 AM, MrTrivia wrote:

At 2/11/09 10:55 PM, DeathNoteetoNhtaeD wrote:

At 2/11/09 10:11 PM, knuxrouge wrote:

At 2/11/09 04:52 PM, Kuro wrote: Also, there's plenty of different 'styles' to shooting a gun. Like say... You could hold a gun sideways.

I laughed when I read this.

Yeah. My take on this is there is numerous ways to kill a person with different types of swords, but only one way to kill someone with every gun. What I mean is that you can stab, slice, slit, chop, and garrotte with a sword, but you can shoot someone with a gun. Sure, you can hold a gun in a different position, but that's not really changing how you kill someone, is it?

But each gun has its own particular usefulness. For example, if you need a headshot from a mile away, you have to use a high-power sniper rifle because nothing else will do. If you're in very close range, you use a pistol. If you're aiming at a very elusive target, you may need a shotgun loaded with buckshot or birdshot that spreads out along the trajectory.

there a bunch of special attacks for a gun toting protagonist...grats.
you also forgot costumization such a thing would be a needed feat for badass unless your going front mission, fuck i love that game...i like this debate, continue.

Wait let me roll my die.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
7 I killed you.

At 2/12/09 02:53 PM, supyohos123 wrote: Wait let me roll my die.
7 I killed you.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA not funny... And I agree with grey, this is an awesome debate =D

At 2/12/09 12:34 PM, greyshadowskyknight wrote: i like this debate, continue.

Meh, I said what I wanted to say, my point can be explained further, but thats only to those who were too dumb to comprehend it when I first said it, and if someone comes under that instance, then too bad.
I'm really done with this debate, I'll spectate though.
I'm downloading a rom to Tales of Destiny, expect details.

Ah, the game starts out great.

You'll like this guy Grey.

The protagonist is named Stahn, who snuck onto a transport ship, and fell asleep only to be caught by some sailors. They take him to the captain, who is on edge because they're escorting "IT" somewhere and he now suspects Stahn of trying to steal it.

Stuff happens, and monsters invade the ship.
Kill all the sailors and the captain. Stahn goes to get "IT" which happens to be a living sword named (I forgot) something. He fights off the monsters and bails on an escape pod.
He lands, falls unconscious and waked up in a house, apparently saved by a man with white hair named Garr.
*suppressed rage*
I saved and stopped there.
I liked especially where you examine the dead bodies and Stahn just says "What a waste of life", epic.
He look like Flynn Scifo and Luke Fon Fabre's love child.

So, I just beat Vesperia an hour or so back. Turns out Duke wasn't as punishing as I thought. But, regardless, it was a great game, but not enough to pass Symphonia. However, I remember a few pages back I provided this order of my favorite Tales games: Symphonia > DotNW > Vesperia. Well, Vesperia and DotNW are switching spots. Vesperia just had so much more love put into it than DotNW did. And when that happens, every aspect of the game is better for it, making it harder to like the cheaper game. However, as far as story goes, I preferred DotNW's story to that of Vesperia. So now all I can do is sit and wait for Star Ocean 4.

And figure out how to get the goddamn bathhouse scenes.

At 2/16/09 03:00 AM, DeathNoteetoNhtaeD wrote: However, as far as story goes, I preferred DotNW's story to that of Vesperia.

Vesperia was packed full of Deux Ex Machinas.

Glad someone had the balls to reply, I thought my post intimidated everyone.

Well, lets see if I can do it again with my next ToD update.
I went to get a member of a household with Garr, I then went to an adjacent city, where I parted with Garr, stuff happened and I teamed up with some gay (lesbian) looking chick named Mary, we went to a dungeon and save another girl named (forgot, checks Wiki) Rutee, and she is a bitch. I really Dislike her, she's like Rita, but not as smart, no spells and obsessed with money. Small boss fight, we get back to town and turns out Rutee has a swordian (Stahn's is named Dymlos). This one is Atwight. More stuff happens and we set out to another city.

Someone remind me to get Tales of Eternia too, I gotta find out what made Reid so badass.

At 2/16/09 03:00 AM, DeathNoteetoNhtaeD wrote: So, I just beat Vesperia an hour or so back. Turns out Duke wasn't as punishing as I thought. But, regardless, it was a great game, but not enough to pass Symphonia. However, I remember a few pages back I provided this order of my favorite Tales games: Symphonia > DotNW > Vesperia. Well, Vesperia and DotNW are switching spots. Vesperia just had so much more love put into it than DotNW did. And when that happens, every aspect of the game is better for it, making it harder to like the cheaper game. However, as far as story goes, I preferred DotNW's story to that of Vesperia. So now all I can do is sit and wait for Star Ocean 4.

And figure out how to get the goddamn bathhouse scenes.

i havent gotten far in dawn but i'll keep it in mind...duke isnt that hard but he's a total bitch on higher difficulties...hey how about every 50000hp he does big bang...yeah i dealt with that, and i call it wear and tear...oh and dont stop now you got more things to do in vesperia, and i mean more things to do, i havent played in a bit but when im back on im gonna go and do the whole dessert from nordipolica.

At 2/18/09 03:13 AM, greyshadowskyknight wrote: i havent gotten far in dawn but i'll keep it in mind...duke isnt that hard but he's a total bitch on higher difficulties...hey how about every 50000hp he does big bang...yeah i dealt with that, and i call it wear and tear...

Eh, Duke wasn't all that hard. I mean, once I beat the 100 man-melee with Yuri and did a few side quests, he was only 2 levels under final form Duke (65). Everyone else was level 61.

oh and dont stop now you got more things to do in vesperia, and i mean more things to do, i havent played in a bit but when im back on im gonna go and do the whole dessert from nordipolica.

Yeah, a lot more achievements and all that. I did start a new game right after I beat it though, and am right now in the center of Quoi Woods.

And I still need 900,000 Gald.