At 3/15/05 09:23 PM, WadeFulp wrote:
Well put. While we'd love to keep everyone happy, some of these stat people are being very selfish. I don't meant to offend them, but they need to realize we need to prioritize what we do. We have limited resources as far as coding the site, we only have James to do this stuff. Should 99.999% of our users have to wait and wait for cool new features they want and would enjoy because Liljim is forced into catering to the other %0.0001 of our users that want to know every fucking stupid stat?
Like I said, "only having James" to do it... is your own choice. If I had the skills, I would volunteer myself to help him out. I'm sure there are others. Yes, Wade, that's how deep our SICK love of statistics drives us. We'd do shit for no pay to help NG and help other stat-loving freaks. That wonderful 0.0001% of your userbase (and come on.... How many users deposit exp at least once a month? I strongly suspect it's higher than 0.0001%... but then again, perhaps you're talking about overall visitors to the site, including people who never sign up for a NG account, depsite the best efforts of everyone who asks people to sign up for free in front page posts, such as Tom and yourself).
Also, having a high exp was recently used by Tom to qualify most of the people who voted in the "February Top 5 Flashes" awards poll. If stats don't matter, then why the hell was that one of the means used to determine who was a good judge of flash? Oh wait, because stats DO indicate how much someone has used the site. Stats DO indicate how much someone LOVES Newgrounds. Sites DO indicate how much people love flash games and flash movies. At least in part. So please stop calling them "fucking stupid stats."
They say these stats are important to them, but are they willing to compromise Newgrounds.com because they need their stats? If so, then they don't care about the stie and the other peopel who use it. They only care about themselves and their own wants and needs. If this is the case, fuck 'em. Maybe we should just remove their accounts so they have no stats to jerk off.
Willing to compromise NG? Of course not.
Some people only love flash here. They don't even bother to vote. I was one of those people, from 1999-2002. I ended up signing up for a NG account, but I never bothered to get too deeply into the site. I came by maybe once a month to play McFretN games or Assassin or things like that. I deposited grounds gold every now and then, but not very often... and that was the extent to it. I never knew what a blam was during the old system.
It wasn't until late 2002/early 2003 that I introduced myself by accident (for the most part) to the review system, the BBS, and the blam/protect system.
And what did these stat-based systems do? Well, they got me more interested in coming to NG EVERY DAY. If I hadn't had stats to pull me in completely, I never would have SEEN the amount of flash I have experienced. And I certainly never would have become a mod on this site or anything else. I would have stayed a casual fan of NG who didn't make a point of coming by that often. Yet it's a "SHAME" that liljim spends any time at all making anything to do with stats here on NG? Who made the stat pages to begin with, anyway? Who had the idea for a top 50 exp list, or a top 50 b/p list, or a top 50 popularity list (now the stickerlist has replaced it, of course)?
But then again... if it weren't for NG stats... I would have used a lot less of my own free time here... and a lot less of NG's bandwidth. So perhaps we all should have preferred that eventuality?
OR they could just wait until we're ready to give them the stats they want. Even if they have to wait a year. We've had a few things in the works for over a year now that keep getting put off because we have to attend to these problems.
We're fine with waiting, Wade! No one ever said we were all a bunch of inconsiderate, impatient jackasses. You seemed to just assume that.
At 3/15/05 09:37 PM, WadeFulp wrote:
It's the people that don't care about Newgrounds and just want to know some stupid stats, like "I HAVE TO KNOW IF I'M STILL RANKED 304 FOR B/P POINTS! I DON'T CARE IF IT SLOWS THE SITE DOWN FOR THE OTHER 500,000 VISITORS! ME ME ME!" These people are selfish and I will not tolerate them. If they want to fuck with the site for their own personal interests I will take them out if I have the chance.
Most of those people are newbies who don't know it slows down the site, actually. But if there is someone who's out there and actually DOES think that way? Well, I feel pity for them. Take them out if you wish, but that's not necessarily the best answer, either. EDUCATING them, is. And at least you've certainly educated some of us by not remaining silent and coming into this thread and actually SAYING things, so thank you for that.
At 3/15/05 10:42 PM, WadeFulp wrote:
We are compromising! WTF! If we said "Stop gathering stats! We don't want you to know them" would not be compromising. I said LilJim is working on getting you all stats, but you might not get all the ones you want right away. If it takes us a year, it takes us a year. Maybe you guys need to compromise.
We ARE perfectly willing to compromise. A huge chunk of my single post on page 3 was exactly ABOUT us compromising, and the various ways we WOULD have compromised two months ago.
I said that if liljim had asked us or told us to stop using the programs back in January, we WOULD have.
We could have found other, less-database-intensive ways to make our lists, we could have shortened our lists, or we could have stopped them altogether.
...
Anyway, I still haven't heard from liljim his verdict on this whole matter. Until that time, I will be cancelling both my Top 500 Voting Power list and my pentalist in their current forms. That'll be MY personal compromise on this matter.
I don't think either of my lists is that harmful, as I update one every saturday and the other one every OTHER saturday, but I do pull 1000+ profiles for the first one (the weekly one)... and around 400 profiles for the other one (the twice-a-month one). That second one is certainly less intensive, though. Perhaps I'll just have to do some shit manually. But it's a pain in the ass. We'll see. liljim, I look forward to... and am still waiting for... that light I hoped you would shed on these matters... back on page 3.