@DM692

It's not worth arguing over but Elfen Lied is (in my eyes) the worst anime I've ever sat through. I've never understood people's enthusiasm toward Elfen and it's characters when everything about it is so blatantly shallow. It tries so hard to be messed up that by the halfway point they have to cut a little girl's limbs off and beat a puppy to death to attempt to get a rise out of the viewer. It barely even starts before it stops being horror and veers toward comical. It's not relatable, it's edgy for the sake of being edgy and no amount of blood pinatas or nudity can make up for such a severe lack of talent or make it stand up as a deep or mature anime alongside the likes of Evangelion or the work of Satoshi Kon (or Ghost in the Shell, I guess).

This is just how I felt about it though, I wont forcefully try to convince you that something is shallow or soulless if it meant something to you. With that list I can see you're fairly inexperienced with anime (and perhaps to serious or "deep" art in general?) so maybe you'll see why Elfen Lied fails to impress most people once you have a better reference point. In my experience Elfen is beloved exclusively by young teens who simply have nothing that's actually good to compare it to. Hence why "entry-level" gets thrown around so much an an insult, like that other guy helpfully demonstrated in this thread.

I don't want to keep bashing something you enjoy here, but try watching Neon Genesis Evangelion. A show that, imo, excels everywhere than Elfen Lied falls flat. They're prime targets for comparison (along with Mirai Nikki, which you might like as it's essentially this decade's Elfen Lied) for both being "messed up" with deep characters, but to me Eva is so far ahead of EL in every aspect. The majority of the hate for Elfen most likely just comes from people who saw Evangelion first, which came 9 years earlier and achieved so much more. I haven't read the manga and it may well be the story that the anime wanted to and should have been, but with how much I disliked the show I doubt it would change my mind.

I personally don't like when people throw around words like 'deep' or 'deconstruction' or any of those other lofty words used to describe Evangelion. I liked Evangelion, probably not as much as most people but I really liked it's unconventional style and it's exceptional maturity for the medium. However, I always thought that 'deep' kind of writes a check the show doesn't really cash and is honestly better for it. To me 'deep', in the positive sense, means that the show says something about society or humanity or some other lofty idea and does so in a way that puts a unique perspective on the issue it's tackling while still being accurate and in the best of cases even objective.

I don't think Evangelion really tries to say anything about big subjects like humanity or society and is much more of an introspective show that wants the viewer to think about how they relate to the characters, specifically Shinji. Yeah, Shinji has his paternal issues but I don't think it's done in a way that's really all that pervasive or 'edgy'. Like Jackho said, shows like Elfen Lied try to equate being serious and mature with violence and pervasive material like rape or animal cruelty but they don't accomplish anything with it except shocking or appalling the viewer until eventually it's stops being about interactions between characters and how their experiences affect them and more about 'wow this f*cked up world sure is crazy aaaaaa'. Shows like that weaken the work shows like Evangelion do to advance the maturity of anime and move the medium forward. I'm not saying every show has to be introspective or mature; if you only watch what is deemed to be as such it'll just become exhausting after a point really, but shows like Elfen Lied manage to be not only immature but completely saturated in melodrama that makes it equally exhausting with none of the insight.

I've never seen Elfen Lied, but rating Cowboy Bebop only 7.5 is wrong. As far as the worst anime I've sat down and watched, I think Mars of Destruction and Vampire Wars are up there (even worse than Psychic Wars). If we're talking about popular anime, though, I'd say Pokemon, Digimon or Inuyasha.

At 4/12/14 01:01 PM, Vinnyy wrote: I'm currently watching Death Note. The story line and character development are fantastic.

It might just become one of my favorite short anime series and I've watched quite a lot of anime over the past month alone. I've been on an anime streak lately.

I definitely wouldn't call that a short series. Maybe if most of the anime you watch are over a hundred episodes.

At 4/13/14 01:55 PM, DM692 wrote: Based on my list and ratings, could anyone give me some other suggestions?

I missed this bit before. Going by that list, I think these might work for you.

Samurai Champloo
Darker Than Black
Baccano!
Blue Gender
Black Lagoon
Berserk (heads up, though, it doesn't really have an ending since the manga is still going)
Texhnolyze
Vampire Hunter D and Vampire Hunter D: Bloodlust
Battle Angel
Ninja Scroll

Also, Gantz is kinda disappointing. It wasn't bad, but it could have been better. Plus, Kei Kurono is annoying. The live action movies are awesome, though, except for the shitty downer ending that wasn't even in the manga. Though, I guess some fans might also have an issue with them making all the characters older than in the manga. I wish a good staff would make a new anime series based on it. The anime didn't actually get to the end.

I've noticed that someone voted Cowboy Bebop a 7.5 and Elfin Lied a 10. I get that people have different opinions and tastes, but CB is an anime classic, whereas Lied was more memorable for having a high degree of shock and awe more so than just being memorable. Take all of the "philosophical" stuff aside, {it seems like a lot of people are fond of putting quasi-philosophical stuff in anime that doesn't really fit or even need it at all} Elfin Lied is just another anime that has excessive blood and guts for pure shock value, more so than anything else, and while I think EL is a decent anime overall, there are many better shows that do blood and carnage better, along with having a good story as well. Really, it's just the first episode where the carnage is considered excessive, and then after that, it really just peters out into a rather shallow buddy-buddy show, in other words, it's a one-trick pony.

At 4/14/14 11:55 PM, orangebomb wrote: I've noticed that someone voted Cowboy Bebop a 7.5 and Elfin Lied a 10. I get that people have different opinions and tastes, but CB is an anime classic, whereas Lied was more memorable for having a high degree of shock and awe more so than just being memorable. Take all of the "philosophical" stuff aside, {it seems like a lot of people are fond of putting quasi-philosophical stuff in anime that doesn't really fit or even need it at all} Elfin Lied is just another anime that has excessive blood and guts for pure shock value, more so than anything else, and while I think EL is a decent anime overall, there are many better shows that do blood and carnage better, along with having a good story as well. Really, it's just the first episode where the carnage is considered excessive, and then after that, it really just peters out into a rather shallow buddy-buddy show, in other words, it's a one-trick pony.

Not only that, the rating was based from the enjoyment he had from reading the manga. When it comes to rating an anime series, one can't do just that as the two are still different medias. Elfen Lied is one of the series where the anime starts to diverge from the manga storyline, never mind the fact that Nana was nerfed in the anime in her fight against Mariko.

Is there an end to Nana's suffering?

And to think people gave Victory Gundam tons of flack for overdoing the body count where Uso is essentially the proto-type and the inspiration for Shinji Ikari.

Uso's mom does gave a nice head though.

At 4/14/14 09:45 PM, Jackho wrote: It tries so hard to be messed up that by the halfway point they have to cut a little girl's limbs off and beat a puppy to death to attempt to get a rise out of the viewer.

I'll admit that at some points there were definitely parts that felt they were put in to get a rise out of the viewer, but I personally found they made sense from a narrative point of view. For example, cutting off Nana's limbs set her up for being more vulnerable than the average diclonius under pressure (as she needed to use vectors to control her artificial ones). The puppy was Lucy's breaking point, she was fairly tolerant of humans until they senselessly killed her only friend.

With that list I can see you're fairly inexperienced with anime (and perhaps to serious or "deep" art in general?) so maybe you'll see why Elfen Lied fails to impress most people once you have a better reference point.

I will completely concede this point, until about 6 months ago my only experience with anime was Full Metal Panic!, so I've been trying to absorb as much as I can, and I feel like I'm starting to get into it and appreciate a lot more.

I don't want to keep bashing something you enjoy here, but try watching Neon Genesis Evangelion. A show that, imo, excels everywhere than Elfen Lied falls flat. They're prime targets for comparison (along with Mirai Nikki, which you might like as it's essentially this decade's Elfen Lied) for both being "messed up" with deep characters, but to me Eva is so far ahead of EL in every aspect.

Holy shit I can't believe I forgot to put Evangelion on my list, but I assure you I have seen it, I actually watched it right before Elfen Lied. From a story standpoint I liked the animes about equally, but EL felt like it was so much more open about using devices like nudity and gore (yeah yeah cheesy-ass reasons to like it) to tell the story. Evangelion's scenes with Rei and Shinji on a train are some of my favorite narrative scenes of any media I've consumed and their use of tech intrigued me deeply. However, as generic of a plot device as it is, I found that Kouta from EL uncovering his amnesia made for a really strong vehicle to move the story forward. Evangelion's big overarching "what are Angels/EVAs" was also really good, but not as interesting to me.

It may be because I haven't seen the movies (which I hear tie a lot of stuff together) or read the manga (which would be beneficial for obvious reasons), but I didn't enjoy Evangelion as much as Elfen Lied. Of course, that's not to say I didn't enjoy it because I did thoroughly, but for the reasons outlined above, I found EL to be more to my tastes. I'll also look into Mirai Nikki after I'm done Gantz or something Sense-Offender suggested.

@Sense-Offender

I have looked into Darker than Black, Blue Gender, and Berserk before, I'll have to keep these suggestions in mind. If I get tired of Gantz I'll probably switch onto either one of those or Mirai Nikki.

At 4/15/14 12:38 AM, DM692 wrote: It may be because I haven't seen the movies (which I hear tie a lot of stuff together) or read the manga (which would be beneficial for obvious reasons)

The End of Evangelion is literally my favorite film. The new ones (rebuild) are good but mostly just eye-candy, throwing out most of the psychological stuff and each character's traumas for more fan service and action. It's basically Evangelion for people who didn't like Evangelion. Even so I still consider them to be very good by anime or general film standards, but they never live up to the original. 2.22 is especially awesome.

I wouldn't worry so much about reading the manga, as it was only created to generate publicity for the anime before release and it's made entirely by Sadmoto (the character designer) who seems to not fully understand Anno's characters yet doesn't make them his own for fear of annoying fans I guess. The final chapter is completely different to EoE's ending but other than that it's just the same story, somewhat compressed, with a handful of inconsequential little changes to catch you out. It's a fine read if you're a fan and want more, but it's not essential. Death & Rebirth is just a ~50 minute recap so it's not important either, but I like it.

with gantz and berserk the manga versions are a lot better. while berserk isn't finished, there are a lot of volumes out, it's one of the definitive works in the dark fantasy genre.
gantz is kind of the same, the anime is basically just a promo for the manga, which is just an excess of hyper-violence, sex, and over the top, exciting battles, and it is amazing.

an anime i like to recommend to beginners is Kaiji. it's addicting, suspenseful and deep.

Turns out that link I posted about AOT's season 2 was a fake, but at least you guys get it on Toonami in May. Lucky shits, only Anime on British TV is Pokémon.

At 4/19/14 03:54 PM, darkjam wrote: Turns out that link I posted about AOT's season 2 was a fake, but at least you guys get it on Toonami in May. Lucky shits, only Anime on British TV is Pokémon.

Thank you for the correction. Toonami comes on tonight.

At 4/19/14 08:59 PM, DoctorStrongbad wrote:

At 4/19/14 03:54 PM, darkjam wrote: Turns out that link I posted about AOT's season 2 was a fake, but at least you guys get it on Toonami in May. Lucky shits, only Anime on British TV is Pokémon.

Thank you for the correction. Toonami comes on tonight.

Attack on Titan will be added to the Toonami line-up on May 3, when IGPX finishes its latest run. And apparently, Ghost in the Shell : Stand Alone Complex is being dropped to make room for Beware the Batman on May 10. Damn it, GITS is one of my favorite anime, and it's being replaced by a mediocre show that I thought was cancelled!

At 4/19/14 03:54 PM, darkjam wrote: Turns out that link I posted about AOT's season 2 was a fake, but at least you guys get it on Toonami in May. Lucky shits, only Anime on British TV is Pokémon.

Most dubbed Anime that are shown in the US aren't worth watching. Plus I think Toonmani would be way better if it came on more frequently

At 4/22/14 07:56 AM, BleachFanatic12 wrote: Most dubbed Anime that are shown in the US aren't worth watching. Plus I think Toonmani would be way better if it came on more frequently

When Toonami was first on the air it was pretty great. What the Toonami is now is what Adult Swim kinda was back when it first aired. Saturday nights were all anime and they ended it back then with Mobile Suit Gundam: Char's Counter Attack. Pretty good way to go out.

I've seen a lot of the Attack on Titan dub, and please tell me I'm not alone when I say 'Holy crap, that is just awful.' I tend to like both dubs and subs. I don't care most of the time. But Attack on Titan's dub is just so many levels of wrong... The TFS Abridged Version is better. I'd rather have all those guys be in charge of the official dub. Just... Mikasa, and Armin's voices just don't do it justice...

Now, on a happier note... I just finished watching Welcome to the NHK for like the ninth time, and it's the best anime I've ever seen. Period.

There. There's my contribution.

At 4/24/14 08:37 AM, Wunderbar wrote: hello friends. what are you watching this season?

I don't think I'm going to focus on any new stuff this season. I hopefully will get through most of my backlog by the time classes are over in June and pick stiff up seasonally again

Beware the Batman is horrible and has no place on Toonami.

So GTO now has a sequel to the original manga series (which itself is a sequel as well but that's besides the point) where after the events in the final story arc, Onizuka was sent to prison.

I can guess what the reason is but either way I'm excited because that means there will be more GTO.

At 4/27/14 12:13 PM, Idiot-Finder wrote: So GTO now has a sequel to the original manga series (which itself is a sequel as well but that's besides the point) where after the events in the final story arc, Onizuka was sent to prison.

I can guess what the reason is but either way I'm excited because that means there will be more GTO.

The first chapter has been scanlated by KIKE scans already. Definitely picking it up, but I still need to read Shonan Junai Gumi -- in french, no less, because I'm pretty sure Vertical hasn't released the full series yet.

At 4/27/14 06:09 PM, towelie101 wrote:

The first chapter has been scanlated by KIKE scans already. Definitely picking it up, but I still need to read Shonan Junai Gumi -- in french, no less, because I'm pretty sure Vertical hasn't released the full series yet.

I wish Shonan Junai Gumi had a more proper anime adaptation, it deserves better than an OVA. Then again it was GTO that brought much of the attention in the first place but still, in that series you get to see Ryuuji being involved alot more and not to mention Nagisa's split personality disorder brought on by Stockholm Syndrome (it is mentioned in GTO that she was studying psychology, I wonder why...).

Saejima was somewhat of a joke character though but the series brought in a bit more when it comes to some of the characters' background.

Not to mention it was before Onizuka became a super human in GTO so you get to see him getting beaten up.

At 4/28/14 08:18 PM, Vinnyy wrote: I'm currently reading the manga for Claymore.

I've not watched the anime myself but i've been reading the manga for a long time. I've kind of lost track of everything that is and has happened but i'm still caught up. Honestly I don't even like Claymore that much it's a solid 6.5~7/10 series to me but I like it enough to stick with it I guess. I just find Priscilla to be the most absolutely boring villain and later and later on things just seem to be a little too talky for such a series that's really pretty shallow at the end of the day. I wouldn't discourage anyone from reading it if they're interested but it's not one i'd really reccommend.

Funny thing is that last night I had a dream where Joe Yabuki helps an alien (somewhat an ET ripoff) get home. Afterward, Joe went to face Jose Mendoza in his final match.

Then I check out mangahere and found out this have been finished scanned and translated last night!

That was quicker than I expected ever since someone came and picked it up.

I finished off Ouran Highschool Host Club the other day. This is a show that was surprisingly good. I decided to watch it a while back because it had good reviews and was going cheap, but at the same time I was really unsure if I'd like it, given that it looked a bit girly. It was just a pleasant show to watch with a sort of feel good vibe to it.

Decided to take a change and give Code Geass a go. Know almost nothing about it but I hear it's one of the higher rated series. Was hoping that would have arrived today but unfortunately not.

At 5/3/14 12:20 PM, Dean wrote: I finished off Ouran Highschool Host Club the other day. This is a show that was surprisingly good. I decided to watch it a while back because it had good reviews and was going cheap, but at the same time I was really unsure if I'd like it, given that it looked a bit girly. It was just a pleasant show to watch with a sort of feel good vibe to it.

It is a shoujo series so the design will look a bit girly, doesn't stop me from looking at Skip Beat manga (though the story have slowed a bit recently).

At 5/3/14 12:30 PM, Idiot-Finder wrote: It is a shoujo series

I'm totally lost when people start using these terms. I'll occasionally watch anime now and again, but I always feel so out the loop when it comes to discussing it :(

At 5/3/14 09:49 PM, Vnzi wrote: First off, I need some help deciding on what to watch. I have a choice of either Jojo's third arc so far or catch up with NGE again.

Haven't seen NGE. Blue Gender is an awesome mech anime. I've only seen the older JJBA.

Second, my friends are forcing me to watch SAO so I might not survive the night. Wish me luck.

What a freaking overrated show. It's mediocre at best.

At 5/5/14 12:53 AM, Vnzi wrote:

At 5/4/14 06:19 PM, Sense-Offender wrote: Haven't seen NGE. Blue Gender is an awesome mech anime. I've only seen the older JJBA.

I remember seeing Blue Gender on a DBZ DVD in the trailers for things and I remember being really interested in that show. I still want to watch it, but I don't know if it's up to par of my childhood expectations.

Might that have been the movie Lord Slug? I remember seeing a trailer on the VHS for that when I was 12 years old (before the show started airing on AS) and I still wanna know what that music is.

What a freaking overrated show. It's mediocre at best.

SAO is on the top of my list of worse animes ever, and it still baffles me how anyone would actually want to watch that.

hah. Well, I don't completely dislike it, but its popularity confuses me. I think it's okay, at least until the Alfheim arc when it just sucked. But even before that, it wasn't that good, just meh. As far as worst anime I've seen, I'd say Inuyasha, Naruto, Pokemon, Digimon, Vampire Wars and Mars of Destruction. Plus, Beyblade, if we're counting anime of which I've never actually sat through a whole episode. Jesus, give me fucking Vampire Wars over that. I keep waking up during the week to that show and I just want to murder the voice actors. It's like CN's morning lineup is meant to convince those who fall asleep watching AS to off themselves. I dunno why it's called Hero 108, but if that's a head count, I'm advocating mass murder via nuke for once.

At 5/5/14 03:18 PM, Vnzi wrote:
Oh god don't even get me started on that series. Based on a gimmick, of course it's going to be bad. At least Yugioh puts some effort into it.

To be fair, Yu-Gi-Oh did started out as a horror manga and the card game was a plot device that the author put in because he happens to be a fanboy of MTG, just didn't think it would become popular enough to hijack the series.

While the card games are fun, I actually like the series before the card game plot took over.

At 5/5/14 04:26 PM, Vnzi wrote:

At 5/5/14 04:22 PM, Idiot-Finder wrote: To be fair, Yu-Gi-Oh did started out as a horror manga and the card game was a plot device that the author put in because he happens to be a fanboy of MTG, just didn't think it would become popular enough to hijack the series.

While the card games are fun, I actually like the series before the card game plot took over.

Wow, I didn't know that. Might look for the original manga if it's any good, but right now I'm working on catching up with Jojo.

http://www.mangahere.com/manga/yu_gi_oh/

Here you go.

i watched the anime adaptation of yu-gi-oh before they start playing the card game, thought it was pretty bad. when they start playing the game it wasn't that interesting either.
i think inuyasha was pretty good at first, i like the dark medieval japan atmosphere, and all the different youkai. however i felt like the time travelling aspect added nothing and the segments that took place in modern time were pointless. it also starts to feel very dragged out at some point, because they always get close to beating the villain and he escapes, so i lost interest.