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The Flash 'Reg' Lounge

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 08:05:31


At 10/25/06 07:34 AM, The-Super-Flash-Bros wrote: I can tell you that lip syncing was the one thing that took up the most time in Declines 2 and 3. Anyting that gets the same result in even half the time would be awesome.

Hey, would you like to be a part of this? I feel that if when i released it, if had examples of this technique being used on characters from a popular series, people would be more likely to use it, and it would bring more traffic to your site and animations. Obviously, you could choose for it only to be released if the lipsyncing turns out to be good enough.

If you would like to be part, i would need a flash file consisting of the head and upper body of on of your decline characters along with these different mouths for whcihever character you use. Also, i'd need some audio for it to be lipsynced to. Perhaps the character saying two or three phrases like "Welcome to the actionscript lipsyncer" or something, or even pre recored phrases from the decline episodes.

If you are interested, you could upload the fla to devish.net and then PM it to me, or directly email it to cybex@ketayo.com

If you're not interested, anyone else want in?

The Flash 'Reg' Lounge

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 10:16:08


Can I try it out Cybex?


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BLOG ~ Dont fuck around with my dog. All that I can see I steal. ~

NG FFR ~ Automatic for the people.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 12:49:17


At 10/25/06 07:26 AM, Jesus wrote: Hi, i'm developing an AS lipsyncer tool, which could potentially stop the need for lipsyncing yourself, and save hours of your time. Also, it's just as good as doing it yourself. (Here's an example of it in action).
Do you think this could ever catch on?

Hey thats cool, when its done it should be very useful, it should catch on like the vcam!


Whoa its me!

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 12:58:00


At 10/25/06 10:16 AM, PureGonzoMedia wrote: Can I try it out Cybex?

Yeah, but be warned, you're up against cicla.

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 13:46:36


At 10/25/06 12:58 PM, Jesus wrote:
At 10/25/06 10:16 AM, PureGonzoMedia wrote: Can I try it out Cybex?
Yeah, but be warned, you're up against cicla.

Whoa. Jesus is Cybex? Dude I didn't know it was you until now.


No more animated sigs. :(

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:04:30


At 10/25/06 12:08 AM, Bezman wrote: As the complexity of games increases though, I think changing details can bring about a great amount of diversity. The story, art, nuances of control, setting... maybe it's not that less is being changed in modern games - just that those changes form a smaller portion of the full package?

Picture Coca Cola. The bottle and it's advertising changes to suit the times, but inside it's the same flavour as it was when it was created. Granted, that formula's been perfected (and de-cocained) and variations have been drafted, but inside it's the same game.

Like me and Lu said - games can be stripped down to thier underlying patterns if you remove all the surface trappings. Those elegant stories in Half Life and Deus Ex that are ranted and raved about for thier breakthroughs in storytelling, those top of the line PS3 graphics in Motorstorm, and those perfected control systems are the red bottle-cap on your Coca-VideoGame


Another obstacle on the road to greater diversity is almost certainly the lust after realism.

I HATE the concept of photorealistic and physically accurate games... I'm not going to get into it though, because you've covered some of my points without realising it. Cars shouldn't crash - but when they do, they should crash properly. Shame no one at Ferrari will ever let thier car ever be shown damaged. Ever

Try any brainshatteringly original game, like Siboot, Façade or Game of Life
I don't know those. Format? Era?

Trust and Betrayal, the Legacy of Siboot
Released early 90's for the Mac (PC Port available). Donated to the Home of the Underdogs by Chris himself. The premise of the game is that you are in a contest for the rank of High Priest of a religion that covers many alien race. The tournament is a version of rock-paper-scissors that occurs in psychic space when you go to sleep. However, the main bulk of the game involves you talking to your rivals, befriending them, and ultimately betraying them by revealing how strong thier mental defenses for each element are in exchange for information about other rivals. Kicked off the Interactive Storytelling Revolution

Façade; A One-Act Interactive Drama. The first real Interactive Storytelling exercise, released 2005. Trip and Grace's marriage is falling apart, and you've been invited over to thier flat for dinner. Ask them questions, try to play them off against each other, and work out how to piece thier marriage back together. Or simply flirt with them, or insult them and get kicked out. Also free.

Conway's Game of Life (Wikipedia Article). A cellular automaton exercise. Its like watching primordial life grow. Add in a few controls for the user and you have SimLife or Creatures...

At 10/24/06 07:00 PM, AloneInTheDark wrote:
'Originality' is just cutting the original material into smaller pieces before you put it back together and combining in ways others may not instantly think of.

"Good artists copy. Great artists steal"
-- Pablo Picasso


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:35:35


At 10/25/06 01:46 PM, orb wrote:
At 10/25/06 12:58 PM, Jesus wrote:
At 10/25/06 10:16 AM, PureGonzoMedia wrote: Can I try it out Cybex?
Yeah, but be warned, you're up against cicla.
Whoa. Jesus is Cybex? Dude I didn't know it was you until now.

me neither.. where's the free wine goddamnit?!


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:37:37


At 10/24/06 09:52 PM, 23450 wrote: lol. its funny because thats how most games are made these days. look at FPS's. is that not a game of Paintball or Arisoft?

I don't think you can really condemn an entire genre as being ripped off. Some core element must sit as the foundation of a game. Unfortunately, as of late, people are trying to extend and complicate what can constitute that core element. For example, defense games are pretty much considered a genre now, but they shouldn't be. It was a game idea that was emulated again and again until everybody decided that they weren't so much borrowing a known idea as they were just making a game in a certain genre or something like that. This trend is definitely going to become a refuge of the creatively dull, in the Flash world, and out. I think they've already got a 'genre' name for the games boosting off of GTA's fame.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:44:57


I just went on a short but fun trip through NG, started out at Afro's site linked back here to his Pico day movie, then watched Luis's Clock movie and Pico Vs Convict, then came here to report.

There really is quite a few holidays with NG and that made me happy :)


WEBSITE

BLOG ~ Dont fuck around with my dog. All that I can see I steal. ~

NG FFR ~ Automatic for the people.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:46:16


i think we can agree here that it all boils down to this:

If the games is fun, it doesnt matter what it's based off of, the important thing is to do it well.

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:46:25


At 10/25/06 02:37 PM, NegativeONE wrote: I think they've already got a 'genre' name for the games boosting off of GTA's fame.

Depending who you ask it's "Freeform Criminal Sim" or "GTA-Clone" (tending towards the latter). The line blurs with games like Mercenaries and Just Cause, but they all share the same "tags". Freeform, choose your own missions, or screw the mission structure entirely and go postal

Speaking of GTA clones, my copy of Canis Canum Edit arrives on Friday if Amazon's not lying to me again. Anyone played Bully in the States yet? Or did Thompson get it banned?


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:56:06


^ Bully looks like an interesting game, rockstar games reminds me of newgrounds in that its always trying to push the envelope... so far its not banned yet, but its been getting alot of heat from bored house moms with nothing better to do.

I wish rockstar would stop making new games for ps2... its so 20 years ago.

-L


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:59:11


At 10/25/06 01:18 AM, DingoEatingFuzz wrote:
At 10/25/06 01:01 AM, Luis wrote: Jmtb's recent 4 second game extravaganza is a good example...
Yes, Jmtb's four second extravaganza that didn't get a weekly. Newgrounds can be such a fair place at times with everything ranked accordingly, but then others it all seems backwards. I'm not saying this is backwards, but I don't think it is quite accurate. This game had a 4.52 out of judgement and once it hit the front page, in a matter of hours it was down to a not so shiny 4.17. Other submisions can be on the front page and grow in score to a 4.30+ like this week.

Well i think that is because during the judgement period, alot of the artists involved all voted 5 on it and that's why it quickly got such a high score. Also people who anticipated the project will usually quickly vote high on it and people that have the artists as their fav artists. Once something hits the frontpage, more (objective) viewers will vote on it and the score becomes more accurate.
I think one of the biggest advantages of NG is that it gets your material to alot of viewers. I dont care about score, but I do want alot of people to see my work and have an opinion about it. Wether they like or hate it, doesnt really matter to me. (In fact, i loved the reviews for autumn tree where people gave a 0 because they felt the flash showed sympathy with Klebold & Harris.)


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 14:59:40


At 10/25/06 02:56 PM, Luis wrote: I wish rockstar would stop making new games for ps2... its so 20 years ago.

Not the same sentiment for us Brits. We don't get the PS3 until March, so we're hanging onto every technological release like it's gold dust. Decent PS2 games will be needed for us at Christmas, if only to give the Wii something to outshine.

Sony likes to use the EXTRA spikey strap ons for Europe.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 16:05:16


At 10/25/06 07:26 AM, Jesus wrote: Hi, i'm developing an AS lipsyncer tool, which could potentially stop the need for lipsyncing yourself.....

Just a suggestion: if you can, you could make it like that when you write a letter with caps, there would appear different mouth shape - example: if you write "A" mouth shape would be big version of "a", like character is screaming or talking more loudly.
I think this would be really great tool, because lipsyncing really does take a lot of time and is boring thing to do if movie has a lot of talking.

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 16:32:56


At 10/25/06 07:26 AM, Jesus wrote: Hi, i'm developing an AS lipsyncer tool, which could potentially stop the need for lipsyncing yourself, and save hours of your time. Also, it's just as good as doing it yourself. (Here's an example of it in action).

I already made one for my personal projects. =)
Not going to get into too much detail but it's kind of like typing in the plot script phonetically and AS does the rest.

Has saved me quite a bit of time on my newest cartoon venture.

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 16:33:22


At 10/25/06 04:05 PM, FreshGrass wrote: Just a suggestion: if you can, you could make it like that when you write a letter with caps, there would appear different mouth shape - example: if you write "A" mouth shape would be big version of "a", like character is screaming or talking more loudly.
I think this would be really great tool, because lipsyncing really does take a lot of time and is boring thing to do if movie has a lot of talking.

I like the idea, and i would do that, but i don't want it to suddenly go angry when people use capitals from habit. For example, if i wrote "Hi, my name is Cybex" i wouldn't want it to go angry for the H and the C. Besides, if people want angry bits, it would work a lot better if they just created a new one with angry mouths.

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 21:15:14


Here's something that I always think about. I love how with music, if you've seen an action (a video I mean) to the music, then that sticks with it when you hear the song. The best example I think for this is This video (The Strokes - You only live once). Look at how when he says certain lines the camera will jump cut to a new angle for some reaction or whatever. This all ties in in my mind and whenever I hear the song I think about it. Look at how the oil is all watery even though you'd imagine it to be quite thick and sludgy, you see it up against the drum and it looks so dense (?).. this is all sort of the imagery that sticks with you when you hear it again.

An example of this, or something that relates to it, is when you're on certain drugs, you get this same feeling where shit all becomes the same, for example I remember feeling my shirt and then feeling a friends shirt, then him saying 'So that's what Blue feels like..', Well no it's not, that's what that fabric feels like. It's the same thing when you clench your fist and bite your teeth together.

This leads onto something else i've been closely thinking about.. how do you relay the feeling/texture etc of something through film? How do you show the weight of it etc, how do you convey that feeling.

Does anybody get what i'm on about? This was a bit of a ramble, so sorry.


WEBSITE

BLOG ~ Dont fuck around with my dog. All that I can see I steal. ~

NG FFR ~ Automatic for the people.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 21:29:33


At 10/25/06 09:15 PM, PureGonzoMedia wrote:
This leads onto something else i've been closely thinking about.. how do you relay the feeling/texture etc of something through film? How do you show the weight of it etc, how do you convey that feeling.

Does anybody get what i'm on about? This was a bit of a ramble, so sorry.

In my opinion one good factor to influence feeling is the use of colors. If you watch films on video/DVD and you compare the colors that are present in the film and the way things actually look, you will see, in many movies, that the colors are unrealistic. A lot of emotion comes through colors, I like greyish blues because of the tragic, cold and restful feelings that they convey.


This sig is 100% effective protection from all hexes, curses, evil spirits and bad karma. Guaranteed.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 21:53:19


At 10/25/06 09:29 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: In my opinion one good factor to influence feeling is the use of colors. If you watch films on video/DVD and you compare the colors that are present in the film and the way things actually look, you will see, in many movies, that the colors are unrealistic. A lot of emotion comes through colors, I like greyish blues because of the tragic, cold and restful feelings that they convey.

Yeah, we watched the beginning to Gladiator in class, and I icked up on how at the start we see Russell Crowes hand moving through the corn, and the colours are all golden, then we go to a war scene and it's greyish blue. It's quite intresting when you look at cinematography and pick it apart.


WEBSITE

BLOG ~ Dont fuck around with my dog. All that I can see I steal. ~

NG FFR ~ Automatic for the people.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:33:15


Say, next year for halloween, i am going to make the scariest, crap your pants, halloween game ever made in flash.

What exactly makes something scary to you though? I have a rough idea of what i'm going to do (yet i'd still need an artist... when the time comes)

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:35:12


At 10/25/06 10:33 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: What exactly makes something scary to you though? I have a rough idea of what i'm going to do (yet i'd still need an artist... when the time comes)

I believe something completely black with brutal lightnings, at least thats what makes somethings look more "eerie" in my opinion, anyway. Fog is also good... Rotten trees, and good ambient music ftw.

an eerie style is stupidly difficult to draw...

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:36:23


At 10/25/06 10:35 PM, blanket-ghost wrote: I believe something completely black with brutal lightnings, at least thats what makes somethings look more "eerie" in my opinion, anyway. Fog is also good... Rotten trees, and good ambient music ftw.
an eerie style is stupidly difficult to draw...

it kinda is but I know some good artists :P

BTW it takes place in a house. I do plan to do a lot with the lighting, and puzzles and such

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:42:17


At 10/25/06 10:36 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: it kinda is but I know some good artists :P

Just letting you know because the ammount of shading needed is stupidly big... :P And there has to be a lot of details, cracks, holes in the house... etcetc.

BTW it takes place in a house. I do plan to do a lot with the lighting, and puzzles and such

Lightning is the key. :D

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:43:55


Hey, look at my shiny game!

Game!

That is all.

Tom~

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:45:06


At 10/25/06 10:43 PM, The-Super-Flash-Bros wrote: Hey, look at my shiny game!

Game!

That is all.

Tom~

That game is soo cool! Nice job on the 3-D thing!


Whoa its me!

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:46:58


At 10/25/06 10:43 PM, The-Super-Flash-Bros wrote: Tom~

Looking great so far... Im playing. :D Fifened... And thanks for killing any spare time i had left to work on my other projects. >_<

Great game. :D

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 22:51:06


At 10/25/06 02:04 PM, pirateemoninja wrote: Picture Coca Cola. The bottle and it's advertising changes to suit the times, but inside it's the same flavour as it was when it was created. Granted, that formula's been perfected (and de-cocained) and variations have been drafted, but inside it's the same game.

Like me and Lu said - games can be stripped down to thier underlying patterns if you remove all the surface trappings. Those elegant stories in Half Life and Deus Ex that are ranted and raved about for thier breakthroughs in storytelling, those top of the line PS3 graphics in Motorstorm, and those perfected control systems are the red bottle-cap on your Coca-VideoGame

I think stories and settings affect a game more than the bottle cap though. Maybe as much as a bottle? The bottle can make a big difference.

Sure, games can be stripped down to what we have to press when we get down to it, but the information we're fed back is just as important.

Example 1 - my own two games for FSFS - 'click the difference' and 'pull the carrot'. The former asks the player to spot a difference and click it. The latter asks the player to follow a line leading from a carrot to one of 4 bunches of leaves and click the correct leaves. Both require the same task to be done - click a certain area within the four seconds. But both are accomplished in different ways by the player's mind.

Example 2 - Pokemon Snap/1st person shooters. Really, they're both about lining up a target then clicking. Again, motivations differ and the stuff going on in your head, which is what really matters, is different.

In a game, if you're told 'shoot person x', that'll result in different thoughts passing through your head than if you're given some information, before you're faced with the task of deciding upon the morally correct decision and maybe searching for other clues.

Any game with any grounding in reality has a setting, which forms part of the package. Games can and should take advantage of that - a fusion of a better story and a tired genre is a big step forward. Narration, difficult as it may be to pull off effectively when we're allowed to control the protagonist, is something that can take games places they otherwise couldn't go.

Films are a fusion of pictures, sound... and the story. Whilst some do have stunning visuals (House of Flying Daggers comes off the top of my head) and some do stylise their colours or whatever (Fight Club) the main thing that distinguishes live action films, in my opinion, is the story.

In games, that will (and should) normally be second place to the issue of interactivity - forcing us to make interesting choices. But just think how much potential there is in meshing good narration with good, constantly working, game mechanics.

For the record, I'm not saying Half-life is original. In fact, I haven't played through either (though I've been meaning to). Just that they should totally be applauded for any progress they made in the field of storytelling.

And the controls? Come on, man - that's vital! That's maybe like developing the formula. The graphics are the wrapper on the bottle.

I HATE the concept of photorealistic and physically accurate games... I'm not going to get into it though, because you've covered some of my points without realising it. Cars shouldn't crash - but when they do, they should crash properly. Shame no one at Ferrari will ever let thier car ever be shown damaged. Ever

But other cars do crash properly... or at least try to.

Try any brainshatteringly original game, like Siboot, Façade or Game of Life
I don't know those. Format? Era?
Trust and Betrayal, the Legacy of Siboot
Façade; A One-Act Interactive Drama.
Conway's Game of Life (Wikipedia Article).

Thanks very much for those links.

No time at present to read the article properly and play, but am looking forward to doing both - specially the latter - at some point in the future.

"Good artists copy. Great artists steal"
-- Pablo Picasso

Speaking of which... did you guys hear about Damien Hirst and the 'perfect daisy' image (or whatever the original was called)?

What's your take on that?

At 10/25/06 02:37 PM, NegativeONE wrote: For example, defense games are pretty much considered a genre now, but they shouldn't be. It was a game idea that was emulated again and again until everybody decided that they weren't so much borrowing a known idea as they were just making a game in a certain genre or something like that.

I'd argue that what you actually do in a defense game can vary massively though. I mean grabbing guys and flicking them in the air is different enough to shooting, and giving projectiles an actual trajectory again alters it sufficiently.

And if we can call colour-matching defense game, defense games, then we could maybe stretch the term to Zoop...

This trend is definitely going to become a refuge of the creatively dull, in the Flash world, and out. I think they've already got a 'genre' name for the games boosting off of GTA's fame.

Well, technically, it may be a very specific genre, or an awfully contraining one, but can't it still be a genre?

The whole concept of having to pigeonhole and label stuff is stupid anyway. Everything can just be explained on its own terms using as many or as few words as necessary.

At 10/25/06 02:46 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: If the games is fun, it doesnt matter what it's based off of, the important thing is to do it well.

And to do it better than any identical games, if such things exists.

At 10/25/06 09:15 PM, PureGonzoMedia wrote: An example of this, or something that relates to it, is when you're on certain drugs, you get this same feeling where shit all becomes the same, for example I remember feeling my shirt and then feeling a friends shirt, then him saying 'So that's what Blue feels like..', Well no it's not, that's what that fabric feels like. It's the same thing when you clench your fist and bite your teeth together.

???

This leads onto something else i've been closely thinking about.. how do you relay the feeling/texture etc of something through film? How do you show the weight of it etc, how do you convey that feeling.

I'd say you show the weight mainly through motion. No idea for texture, other than either showing something moving by it and reacting (friction?) or just showing a close-up and hoping your brain realises what something that looks that way would feel like.

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 23:23:21


At 10/25/06 10:45 PM, Shmelo wrote:
At 10/25/06 10:43 PM, The-Super-Flash-Bros wrote: Hey, look at my shiny game!

Game!

That is all.

Tom~
That game is soo cool! Nice job on the 3-D thing!

Cool?

That game is FUCKING AMAZING. Man if that goes below a 4.8, I'll rip anyone who voted below a 5's head off >=(

This is probably the greatest thing I've ever played in Flash. At the look of the tutorial, I thought it would be your average point and click mouse adventure game. Then it said you can move with WASD, so I'm thinking, oh, that's pretty cool. When I start the game, and see a full 3D environment that I've been able to play in for over an hour, I was blown away. Call me exagerative but this is seriously amazing..... Great job guys =)

Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2006-10-25 23:26:58


At 10/25/06 10:43 PM, The-Super-Flash-Bros wrote: Hey, look at my shiny game!

Game!

That is all.

Tom~

Nice movement sprite. I like the visual aspects of it, its a bit heavy even on a powerhouse machine but i like the ambitious nature of it.

-L


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