At 8/19/15 02:02 PM, Sam wrote: Haven't done much programming outside of PHP

:(

At 8/19/15 02:02 PM, Sam wrote: Haven't done much programming outside of PHP and JS recently cause I'm working as a web dev. I miss Haxe.

Sounds about right, I've been working on our new subdomain sitechecker
Been a while since I've done webdev stuff. I mostly handed the project over to our web team since I'm just about done with it. Hopefully they can make it purty.

On a side-note, I noticed we registered the domain playtetrisfullscreen.com (sp?) and we haven't done anything with that.
I'm gonna dust off my AS3 skills and library and see what I can't do. Sounds like fun :)

At 8/19/15 12:03 PM, MSGhero wrote: My apartment just texted me, and the message had "MSG" in it. I was like how did they find out? But it was "message."

Your apartment can text? Is it like Hal?

At 8/21/15 09:04 AM, Rustygames wrote: Your apartment can text? Is it like Hal?

Yeah, except it's really dumb because the elevators take a solid 10 mins to get to your floor.

At 8/21/15 11:56 AM, MSGhero wrote: Yeah, except it's really dumb because the elevators take a solid 10 mins to get to your floor.

"I'll take the stairs, thanks.."

Also, apparently my new web server is super memory efficient
I bought a server, gave it a name, and put two websites on it. I feel all special and shit now :3

At 8/21/15 11:56 AM, MSGhero wrote: Yeah, except it's really dumb because the elevators take a solid 10 mins to get to your floor.

I guess I should say that the elevators are pretty fast, there's just a bunch of floors, bunch of people, and few elevators.

At 8/21/15 04:00 PM, egg82 wrote: Also, apparently my new web server is super memory efficient
I bought a server, gave it a name, and put two websites on it. I feel all special and shit now :3

I've been looking around recently for hosts and servers and stuff for the future website for my procgen game. We'll start with wordpress+ or whatever it's called since it'll just be a blog with a custom domain. Then if we start doing leaderboards and hosting limited flash and js versions of the game, we'll do some server stuff.

Do you think I'd be fine with shared hosting once we beef up the blog, or should I go for vps? I highly doubt I need a dedicated server.

At 8/21/15 04:07 PM, MSGhero wrote: Do you think I'd be fine with shared hosting once we beef up the blog, or should I go for vps? I highly doubt I need a dedicated server.

Websites are cheap. I pay:
$10/yr for the domain name
$10/yr for the SSL cert
$7.50/mo for the VPS

I can host as many domains on that VPS as I want, so long as the hardware keeps up. If not, I'll just upgrade to the $11/mo one. Or buy extra hardware. Or a new VPS. Whatever, not a big deal.

links:
NameCheap domains/COMODO SSL
Afterburst VPS

Initial Ubuntu 14.04 server setup
Ubuntu automatic updates
Ubuntu 14.04 server hardening
Ubuntu 14.04 LAMP stack
Apache2 virtual hosts for multiple websites
Debian Postfix mail forwarding
NameCheap COMODO SSL w/ Apache2
Generating CSR files with Apache2/OpenSSL

At 8/21/15 04:07 PM, MSGhero wrote: Do you think I'd be fine with shared hosting once we beef up the blog, or should I go for vps? I highly doubt I need a dedicated server.

Shared hosting would work, you just wouldn't have as much control over the server as you would if you got a VPS. If you got with shared you'll probably end up with an Apache server with only a PHP module installed, both of which suck ass.

At 8/21/15 04:38 PM, egg82 wrote: Initial Ubuntu 14.04 server setup

Real men use CentOS for their server.

At 8/21/15 05:04 PM, Diki wrote: Shared hosting would work, you just wouldn't have as much control over the server as you would if you got a VPS. If you got with shared you'll probably end up with an Apache server with only a PHP module installed, both of which suck ass.

Not that they suck, they'll just probably be really old and unconfigurable. I like having a VPS because custom.
.. I just like linux period, really.

Real men use CentOS for their server.

I did, a long time ago. I switched to Ubuntu because fuckin' everything runs Debian these days, and the sheer amount of online knowledge and support Ubuntu has is staggering.

CentOS isn't bad, but Ubuntu is better :P

Also, real men use Arch. You want custom? You got it. Arch Linux will bend you over and make you its bitch.

At 8/21/15 05:11 PM, egg82 wrote: Not that they suck, they'll just probably be really old and unconfigurable. I like having a VPS because custom.
.. I just like linux period, really.

Well, they will most certainly be old and un-configurable, but they most certainly do suck (especially PHP). Apache's asinine design of mapping URIs one-to-one to the hard drive makes developing RESTful applications a huge pain in the ass because .htaccess files are necessary when they shouldn't be. Creating URI routers is equally a pain in the ass with Apache.

Apache is fine for static websites, but for anything dynamic, it is a terrible choice.

At 8/21/15 05:11 PM, egg82 wrote: I did, a long time ago. I switched to Ubuntu because fuckin' everything runs Debian these days, and the sheer amount of online knowledge and support Ubuntu has is staggering.

I just prefer CentOS because it's a significantly faster OS that doesn't come bogged down with a bunch of shit that I really do not need. I like being able to have a fresh install that has nothing but the bare Linux essentials and yum. CentOS requires a lot more work to get things up and running but it isn't a big deal if you're comfortable with command line Linux operations.

I've also never had a single issue finding information on how to do certain things in CentOS, no matter how bizarre or esoteric they may or may not be.

At the end of the day, Ubuntu is the choice for having things be easy and CentOS is the choice for high performance.

At 8/21/15 05:04 PM, Diki wrote: Shared hosting would work, you just wouldn't have as much control over the server as you would if you got a VPS. If you got with shared you'll probably end up with an Apache server with only a PHP module installed, both of which suck ass.

What exactly (or maybe an overview) does "control" over a server mean? Do I really care about that, or is that like a "here's why Linux is better" argument that doesn't matter to me.

At 8/21/15 07:28 PM, MSGhero wrote: What exactly (or maybe an overview) does "control" over a server mean?

I meant that you can log into the server via SSH and do whatever you want via the command line, just as if you were using the physical computer and opened up Terminal. In other words, you can do anything you want on a VPS, such as run web servers, game servers, SQL servers, Git repositories, web crawlers, or anything else you could do if you installed a Linux distro onto your home computer.

With shared hosting, you will most likely just get a server that has FTP access and some kind of web-based control panel, such as cPanel, both of which can't really do much outside of managing web pages.

At 8/21/15 07:28 PM, MSGhero wrote: Do I really care about that, or is that like a "here's why Linux is better" argument that doesn't matter to me.

If you only ever need to have a single web server running that won't be doing anything fancy, then you probably wouldn't need a VPS. But if you wanted to, for example, also run a game server, then a VPS would be a good choice because you could run both the web and game server on the same machine and IP address and just bind them to separate ports.

edit:

Just to clarify, I didn't mean it in any snobby "Linux is the best thing ever" way. You could have just as much control over the server if you had a VPS with Windows Server installed on it. Having said that, Linux is overwhelmingly the most popular OS (Linux is actually a kernel, not an OS, but whatever) of choice for good reason so I would still highly recommend choosing a Linux distro.

At 8/21/15 07:47 PM, Diki wrote: Things

Sorry, I meant like Linux vs windows pc, not servers, as a metaphor. I've heard Linux servers are better than windows because windows installs a gui or something that eats ram.

Sounds like I kinda want vps, but maybe cpanel is enough. I'm slowly getting more comfortable with the command line so maybe vps.

This is cool stuff. Going to check out VPS. I want to look into this stuff as well (I want my own website). I kind of want to play around with it though and not sure how much I'll have time to do it.

What do you guys suggest without wasting money on month fees when I just wanna screw around with it and get a feel? (without it actually out in the internet world)

Is there an easy way can setup and run a web server from my computer locally to mess around with it. Would that really bog down my machine?

I'm interested in developing multiplayer games.

At 8/21/15 10:49 PM, MSGhero wrote: Sounds like I kinda want vps, but maybe cpanel is enough. I'm slowly getting more comfortable with the command line so maybe vps.

cPanel will pretty much only give you options for setting up email accounts, sub-domains, SQL databases, FTP user accounts, and all that. It's just a handy tool for managing web servers. It can't do stuff like setting up a game server to run on the machine or anything.

It's also not free, so there's that.

At 8/22/15 01:49 AM, swishcheese wrote: What do you guys suggest without wasting money on month fees when I just wanna screw around with it and get a feel? (without it actually out in the internet world)

Is there an easy way can setup and run a web server from my computer locally to mess around with it. Would that really bog down my machine?

Install a virtual machine, such as VirtualBox, and then just install a Linux distro on it. It will slow your computer down a little bit while it's running, but so long as you're not trying to play a game or something like that, you won't really notice (unless your computer is really slow/old).

A desktop version of Ubuntu would be your best bet if you don't have much experience with Linux as it will give you a GUI and all that which can still do all the same stuff the server version can do (you just need to open the Terminal application in Ubuntu for command line stuff).

At 8/19/15 04:50 PM, Diki wrote:

At 8/19/15 02:02 PM, Sam wrote: Haven't done much programming outside of PHP

(

It's Laravel and Lumen, don't worry.

At 8/21/15 05:32 PM, Diki wrote: Well, they will most certainly be old and un-configurable, but they most certainly do suck (especially PHP). Apache's asinine design of mapping URIs one-to-one to the hard drive makes developing RESTful applications a huge pain in the ass because .htaccess files are necessary when they shouldn't be. Creating URI routers is equally a pain in the ass with Apache.

Apache is fine for static websites, but for anything dynamic, it is a terrible choice.

I have a couple of Vagrant boxes, one of them being Laravel's homestead. It's got Nginx backing it and I much prefer it.

At the end of the day, Ubuntu is the choice for having things be easy and CentOS is the choice for high performance.

Basically this. I'm comfortable with the command line but for my local dev environment I just want it working out of the box.

At 8/21/15 10:49 PM, MSGhero wrote: Sounds like I kinda want vps, but maybe cpanel is enough. I'm slowly getting more comfortable with the command line so maybe vps.

It's a good learning experience and a hell of a lot of fun (and headache, sometimes) setting up your own server.

Saying that, if all you want is a website then take the easy route. Spend more time perfecting your game than configuring a server.

At 8/22/15 01:49 AM, swishcheese wrote: This is cool stuff. Going to check out VPS. I want to look into this stuff as well (I want my own website). I kind of want to play around with it though and not sure how much I'll have time to do it.

I'd agree with @Diki and say get a vm set up. It'll use your resources but you can always just be more reserved with how much memory and processing power you want to give it if it's slowing it down too much. I personally use Vagrant for the convenience. You can download pre-configured boxes from their repo. But, if you want the exposure and a more intimate knowledge of the set up process, starting from scratch is fun too.

May as well take a sec to recommend some hosting providers, too. DigitalOcean is a favourite of mine for personal projects. For freelance stuff and when building for other people I use Vidahost (a UK provider) and give them a quick rundown of cPanel so they can at least manage the basics themselves.

At 8/22/15 08:36 AM, Sam wrote: It's Laravel and Lumen, don't worry.

That's good. Laravel is the only thing that makes PHP even remotely tolerable, otherwise it's just a clusterfuck of insanity and bad language design.

At 8/22/15 08:19 AM, Diki wrote: A desktop version of Ubuntu would be your best bet if you don't have much experience with Linux as it will give you a GUI and all that which can still do all the same stuff the server version can do (you just need to open the Terminal application in Ubuntu for command line stuff).

Sweet. Thanks Diki and Sam. Will give it go and I'll know who to come bug when I mess things up. Thanks again.

At 8/22/15 10:06 AM, Diki wrote:

At 8/22/15 08:36 AM, Sam wrote: It's Laravel and Lumen, don't worry.

That's good. Laravel is the only thing that makes PHP even remotely tolerable, otherwise it's just a clusterfuck of insanity and bad language design.

My Unbuntu is setup up on my virtual machine.

I will look into Laravel, but do you have any other suggestion to setting up server other than a LAMP server? (that is free)

Maybe ASP.NET web server? Don't really want to use PHP.

At 8/22/15 01:38 PM, swishcheese wrote: My Unbuntu is setup up on my virtual machine.

I will look into Laravel, but do you have any other suggestion to setting up server other than a LAMP server? (that is free)

If you're looking for a web server that is very easy to setup and use, I highly recommend Flask. It's a Python framework, so you'll obviously need to know Python, which isn't hard to learn if you don't. Flask doesn't require any additional programs to run a server because Flask is the server. If you want to setup a mail or SQL server then that would need to be installed separately.

Flask has proper routing so if you're accustomed to the nightmare of Apache and PHP, you will definitely love Flask.

This mega-tutorial is a solid resource for getting a full-featured web server up and running with Flask.

At 8/22/15 01:38 PM, swishcheese wrote: Don't really want to use PHP.

A wise decision.

@swishcheese

Also, if you do decide to try out Flask, installing it is incredibly easy. If you're on Ubuntu, all you need to do is enter these commands into Terminal:

And that's it.

You might need to run them as a super user, which would just require you to put "sudo" before each of the commands.

I've been talking with Sam a bit about this, but I want more eyeballs:

The site right now will pretty much just be blog posts, a mailing list, a custom domain, and @domain.com emails. We were looking at wordpress to do that, and it's $18+8/yr to host. Sam mentioned getting a domain from namecheap.com or elsewhere, and wp charges $13 to use your own domain with their hosting, so that's $11+3+13/yr. Which is basically the same price. (the second number is the whois hiding thing)

Are there alternatives to wp (hosting+ease of blog post) with similar or better pricing? Is the second plan better since we want to eventually move the domain to our own hosting in the future?

At 8/22/15 04:50 PM, Diki wrote: Also, if you do decide to try out Flask, installing it is incredibly easy. If you're on Ubuntu, all you need to do is enter these commands into Terminal:

Sweet. Thanks Diki. Flask installed. Thanks for tutorial, time to mess around and try to figure stuff out :D

oh Yeaaa.. I'm rolling

Diki's pretty much got this.

At 8/22/15 05:08 PM, MSGhero wrote: stuff

$7.50/mo for a cheap VPS with unmetered bandwidth. whois hiding isn't super necessary, but meh.

I came by to say I threw this together earlier today. I'll add a few things to it later, but the majority is done.
Still uploading wordlists, though..

Edit: I don't know why I'm surprised

Hey guys. I'm living in San Francisco now. Well I'm a little embarrassed, because my last game Civvy failed to even reach completion. Blah. I posted a lot about it here, and I appreciate all of your guys support. For real.

I really still have a strong affinity for newgrounds, and the reg lounge. I hope we can all still be posting here when we are old people. My biggest fear is that when one of you guys inevitably makes a minecraft-sized hit that this thread will be found and exploited by non-regs. Anyways..

I'm still doing game development in my free-time, but I am now trying to work alone so that I can isolate my failures from affecting other people.

I'm prototyping a little bullet-hell adventure game right now. Not sure if it will go anywhere, but I'm having fun with it. I posted an image below.

Hope everyone is having a great summer.

At 8/22/15 10:06 AM, Diki wrote: That's good. Laravel is the only thing that makes PHP even remotely tolerable, otherwise it's just a clusterfuck of insanity and bad language design.

And the only reason it makes it tolerable is because all the mess is abstracted by classes :-) Out of sight, out of mind.

At 8/22/15 06:46 PM, swishcheese wrote: oh Yeaaa.. I'm rolling

Hardest part out the way - time to build Facebook.

At 8/22/15 05:08 PM, MSGhero wrote: I've been talking with Sam a bit about this, but I want more eyeballs:

The site right now will pretty much just be blog posts

As much as I don't like WordPress, it's just too easy to get things set up and I think anyone who's done any work in web has some exposure to it so you don't even have to be like "This is where you edit posts...".

a mailing list,

I've has good experiences with MailChimp.

I do really think that the website for a game plays a small part in its success. Sure, it has to look good and sell your game, but I don't think spending hours optimising your web code, images, styles, js and configuring your server to make it load 1s faster is worth it.

You could outsource it, too. Depends on the budget.

I mean, we've spoken about this before so just for the rest of the reg's... I'd rather be spending that time on PR, campaigns and thoroughly testing/tweaking the game. What do the rest of you think?

At 8/23/15 02:39 AM, PrettyMuchBryce wrote: I really still have a strong affinity for newgrounds, and the reg lounge. I hope we can all still be posting here when we are old people.

@Luis is like 45 now so

I'm still doing game development in my free-time, but I am now trying to work alone so that I can isolate my failures from affecting other people.

I can't really say much because I haven't seen a game to completion in a long time, and have only worked with a handful of people, but I wouldn't let that deter you away from collaborating. I think that's one thing that Newgrounds is lacking these days, everyone likes to work alone on their own things. Maybe it's just my skewed perception of 5 years ago, but I remember a lot more coming out of this community working together.

It's also something I had no experience in when I started working as a developer in "the industry". I've never really worked with other programmers before, and in the near future, I'll have to follow guidelines and do code reviews and (actually, for real this time) comment. Only a few of the things that we plan to implement are already in place and within the last 4 months, my understanding of collaborative work has increased tons and consequently made me a better dev.

I'm prototyping a little bullet-hell adventure game right now. Not sure if it will go anywhere, but I'm having fun with it. I posted an image below.

Post a demo when you get a chance

Hope everyone is having a great summer.

You too, hope you're enjoying San Fran!

At 8/23/15 09:17 AM, Sam wrote: As much as I don't like WordPress, it's just too easy to get things set up and I think anyone who's done any work in web has some exposure to it so you don't even have to be like "This is where you edit posts...".

There's also tumblr now that I think about it...they don't seem to charge for using your own domain. I can't imagine it being comparable to wordpress, though.

http://prntscr.com/88wlqr
What do YOUR tabs look like?