At 1/27/13 12:54 PM, Bahamut wrote: New Manilla Road song!!!

Sweetness!

I've been waiting a while just to hear one full song online. Not only that, I've got Helloween's new album to get tomorrow so I'm already happy with metal in 2013 so far!

Shit....that already came out didn't it?

At 1/25/13 11:36 AM, FistofGreedo wrote: Cannibal Corpse,
GWAR,
Metallica,
Anthrax.
Trivium
Hammerfall,

Can you throw in a little 4 more bands ?

At 1/25/13 02:31 PM, Viper50 wrote: And another name for Christian Metal is White Metal.

I think that term applies to black metal with Christian influence.

At 1/25/13 03:12 PM, RyanRoxx666 wrote: I don't really care about religion in music though

I believe Kekal used to have a big Christian influence in their music early on. And they've always been a brilliant metal band.

At 1/27/13 07:47 PM, Sense-Offender wrote:

At 1/25/13 02:31 PM, Viper50 wrote: And another name for Christian Metal is White Metal.

I think that term applies to black metal with Christian influence.

Ah. I thought it mainly applied to other genres of metal where the bands had Christian influences....
Then again it doesn't really matter to me if they have "christian influences" I'd be okay with listening to some of it if I thought it was okay music. Hell Sleep had "Biblical Themes" in their lyrics I consider them one of my favorite bands.

new discovery

Twisted into Form

Anyone have any word on when the "new" Control Denied album is supposed to come out?

At 1/27/13 07:47 PM, Sense-Offender wrote:

At 1/25/13 02:31 PM, Viper50 wrote: And another name for Christian Metal is White Metal.

I think that term applies to black metal with Christian influence.

It does. And I really can't think of any actual good White Metal... or just White Metal in general. What bands are considered WM ?

At 1/27/13 10:24 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: It does. And I really can't think of any actual good White Metal... or just White Metal in general. What bands are considered WM ?

I don't know of any, but I remember Ryan saying that there was one that he thought was really good. I can't remember the name, though.

At 1/27/13 10:24 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: It does. And I really can't think of any actual good White Metal... or just White Metal in general. What bands are considered WM ?

Believer is a prog/thrash band I really like. Overall, I think the term White Metal should not exist. It's just a term that allows for negative preconceived notations, makes you think the band sucks before you even listen to it. Plus, a lot of people use the term to denote bands that have Christian band members, which is even worse. Dumb term, doesn't even denote a band's sound at all.

Plus, I always thought white metal only referred to Christian black metal?

At 1/27/13 01:34 PM, Viper50 wrote:

At 1/27/13 12:54 PM, Bahamut wrote: I've been waiting a while just to hear one full song online. Not only that, I've got Helloween's new album to get tomorrow so I'm already happy with metal in 2013 so far!

Shit....that already came out didn't it?

It did but for some reason it was released a week later for the UK. Same shit happened with 7 Sinners. I can't fathom why this had to happen twice in a row now.

At 1/27/13 10:23 PM, Ganon-Dorf wrote: Anyone have any word on when the "new" Control Denied album is supposed to come out?

Keep dreaming, that album has become the new Chinese Democracy. :(

At 1/28/13 10:16 AM, Bahamut wrote: It did but for some reason it was released a week later for the UK. Same shit happened with 7 Sinners. I can't fathom why this had to happen twice in a row now.

Ah okay. Maybe they wanted their UK fans to wait....I dunno ._.
Though the US had to wait 2 1/2 MONTHS for Black Masses to be released here....so...yeah....

At 1/28/13 11:19 AM, Viper50 wrote: Though the US had to wait 2 1/2 MONTHS for Black Masses to be released here....so...yeah....

Yeah, there's something about a lot of European releases that take a fucking eternity to be released in America. It's such a dumb business practice as those who will not wait will either import it from across the Atlantic Ocean or simply download it from the internet. You'd think they would have clicked onto that by now...

At 1/28/13 12:11 PM, Bahamut wrote: You'd think they would have clicked onto that by now...

You'd think so. But apparently it hasn't dawned on them that they shouldn't take forever to release stuff in other parts of the world because people will just download it illegally. And as a result cost the label a ton of money for doing so.
I mean I could see a couple day delay being fine. Instead making people wait weeks if not months for an album to be released.

http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Horde/3387
White metal or as you can see 'Black' Metal.

So....does anyone here listen to Love Sex Machine?

At 1/28/13 09:55 AM, Tobi wrote: Believer is a prog/thrash band I really like. Overall, I think the term White Metal should not exist. It's just a term that allows for negative preconceived notations, makes you think the band sucks before you even listen to it. Plus, a lot of people use the term to denote bands that have Christian band members, which is even worse. Dumb term, doesn't even denote a band's sound at all.

Well, Believer isn't "White Metal" then, as this term was made up to describe black metal bands with christian and anti-satanic messages. But I'm pretty sure it's never used to describe bands with christian musicians. That would be dumb as fuck...

Plus, I always thought white metal only referred to Christian black metal?

Yes it does.

At 1/28/13 07:42 PM, Anti-pie wrote: http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Horde/3387
White metal or as you can see 'Black' Metal.

Will have to check that out, I guess.

Fratello Metallo

An Heavy Metal band, fronted by a christian monk. Oh well...

About 3 years ago I found a really cool Christian atmospheric black metal band, but I can't remember the band name D: They said on their website that they disliked the term white metal, and that they felt that the term black metal described their music, apart from their lyrical themes of course, which if I remember correctly were mostly about the more mystical side of Biblical stories and whatnot.

Musically speaking, black metal can still be black metal without being anti-religious, but I'm sure there are plenty of black metal enthusiasts and musicians who would argue against such music being labeled as black metal because of the origins of black metal and all that. Like Tobi said, I get the feeling that the term 'white metal' is used most often as a way of saying 'fake black metal' or some other such negative meaning.

At 1/29/13 01:02 AM, Tremulos wrote: Musically speaking, black metal can still be black metal without being anti-religious, but I'm sure there are plenty of black metal enthusiasts and musicians who would argue against such music being labeled as black metal because of the origins of black metal and all that. Like Tobi said, I get the feeling that the term 'white metal' is used most often as a way of saying 'fake black metal' or some other such negative meaning.

Nuclear Blast got life-threats after they released the first Horde album. Some black metal fans would ask the musicians names (who were anonymous, of course). Some bm fans take the nihilistic, anti-christian stuff very very very seriously...

Black metal is defined by style, not lyrics.

At 1/28/13 12:47 PM, Viper50 wrote: I mean I could see a couple day delay being fine. Instead making people wait weeks if not months for an album to be released.

Well that's always fine as different regions have different release days. Most of Europe is Friday while UK is Monday. I know America generally have new releases on Tuesdays. I much prefer the way UK do it and have them released at the start of the week. It's a way of brightening up Mondays.

And now I bring this to everyone's attention. AN OSTRICH SHOOTING LASER BEAMS!!!

What's next?

I'll just put this on the record saying that I admit that "white metal" comment was a bit of a dumb ass moment for me xD

At 1/29/13 10:31 AM, Bahamut wrote: And now I bring this to everyone's attention. AN OSTRICH SHOOTING LASER BEAMS!!!

What's next?

Thats fucking awesome!

Though I'd like to see a robot Platypus fighting a fire-breathing Iguana over a pit of lava.

At 1/29/13 10:13 AM, Sense-Offender wrote: Black metal is defined by style, not lyrics.

And how are lyrics not affecting the style ?

At 1/29/13 12:07 PM, HeavenDuff wrote:

At 1/29/13 10:13 AM, Sense-Offender wrote: Black metal is defined by style, not lyrics.

And how are lyrics not affecting the style ?

seriously? There's black metal out there about fucking trees. Of course it isn't the lyrics. It's the style.

At 1/29/13 07:06 PM, Sense-Offender wrote:

At 1/29/13 12:07 PM, HeavenDuff wrote:

At 1/29/13 10:13 AM, Sense-Offender wrote: Black metal is defined by style, not lyrics.

And how are lyrics not affecting the style ?

seriously? There's black metal out there about fucking trees. Of course it isn't the lyrics. It's the style.

Legitimate question. Why do you freak the fuck out ? Black metal is of course about the sound, but also about aesthetics. And some people would argue that these aesthetics (including the lyrics) have to be dark, nihilistic, evil, satanic, etc.

I'm not stating that this is my opinion, but why is it so obvious to you that the philosophy behind the music doesn't count when it comes to defining a genre ?

At 1/29/13 10:09 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: why is it so obvious to you that the philosophy behind the music doesn't count when it comes to defining a genre ?

What ultimately defines black metal is a stylistic matter. The lyrics can be about anything.

for example

okay, more serious example(and a damn good band)

At 1/29/13 10:46 PM, Sense-Offender wrote:

At 1/29/13 10:09 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: why is it so obvious to you that the philosophy behind the music doesn't count when it comes to defining a genre ?

What ultimately defines black metal is a stylistic matter. The lyrics can be about anything.

for example

okay, more serious example(and a damn good band)

That's not a why :P

At 1/29/13 11:12 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: That's not a why :P

I dunno what to tell you. Black Metal is a style, not a lyrical concept.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to the new Azure Emote album coming out this spring. If you haven't heard these guys, then...

Clarity Thru Apathy

Cosmic Tear

Justified End

A new track from the album was released and it sounds pretty good.

And just as with their first album, Chronicles of an Aging Mammal, the artwork is quite cool.

At 1/29/13 11:28 PM, Sense-Offender wrote: I dunno what to tell you. Black Metal is a style, not a lyrical concept.

If I had to answer my own question, I'd say for one thing, that the first wave of black metal didn't set any rules about satanism, nihilism or whatever. Sure Celtic Frost and Bathory had occult, satan-related, evil oriented themes, but these were lyrical themes and not exactly adherence to those ideologies. You can sing about Satan without worshipping him for real. So it's not like black metal was deeply rooted in this evil stuff. The second wave... it's another story. But I don't think of it as "rules of the genre", since there really wasn't any. It's a tendency in bm to be anti-christian and to swing your dick around with fake blood on your chest (see Profanatica), but it's not like there is only one possibly way to approach the genre.

So I'd say that "white metal" isn't denaturing the genre, even though these bands are pushing against the boundaries some of the fans and musicians of the genre were and are trying to set.

Would that be a good answer ?

At 1/30/13 02:48 AM, HeavenDuff wrote: Would that be a good answer ?

A pretty good answer, I would say.

Take the dictionary definition of genre "A category of artistic composition, as in music or literature, characterized by similarities in form, style, or subject matter." Sense-Offender is basically saying that form and style determine the genre, subject matter being more or less irrelevant in the determining of the genre. However, it can be argued that the subject matter is just as important as form and/or style. It really depends on the person; lyrics are more important to some people than to others.

Personally I end up doing my best to ignore lyrics in black metal, since they tend to directly and violently oppose my own beliefs, so I would be comfortable calling a band "black metal" even if their lyrics are Christian, since I mostly just enjoy the form and style of black metal, not the subject matter. However, perhaps a black metal enthusiast whose beliefs connect with the anti-Christian lyrics of *most* bm bands would adamantly oppose that Christian band being considered a part of the black metal genre, feeling that the Satanic element is essential for any band to be categorized as black metal.

To not-quite-so-tastefully quote Linkin Park in the Metal Hell thread, "in the end, it doesn't even matter." Not unless you're personally invested in the Satanic subject matter so common in black metal, anyways.