He mentioned they could lose sponsors, and hurt the deal with Susan G Komen. My guess is it would have been like he was glad Roman had cancer and hoped it killed him or something.

I can't wait for AEW's TV show to start, and for all the ex-WWE guys to thrive there and prove that they can be compelling characters in and out of the ring. That's the only way anyone can prove to Vince that he's out of touch and force him to either step back, or change his vision.

Keep in mind, when WCW started getting big, Vince was still really hung up on the 80's version of the product. It took the Monday Night Wars, and specifically the NWO angle to convince him fans wanted something more grounded. Most people knew Wrestling was fake, but WCW did a better job of helping fans suspend disbelief.

With that push, Vince woke up and realized he needed a new vision. HE couldn't create that vision so he let writers and superstars have a lot more freedom. The Attitude Era style basically formed itself, and Vince learned what was and wasn't working as all of that evolved.

His mentality is still stuck there, but with the addition of having to make a PG rated product. He's also fallen back into some of his old 80's booking.

In his mind WWE is an ENTERTAINMENT company, not a wrestling company. That's fair if your non-wrestling segments are actually entertaining, but that's where the ball has been dropped. That's where the micromanaging he's famous for has crippled the product. His writers know what he's into, and they write for HIM not the audience.

When it comes to matches, all the action, except for a lot of finishes, tend to be great. The superstars are doing the best they can with what they've been given.

It's no coincidence the hottest thing to happen recently was Kofi winning the WWE Championship. And that was because it wasn't supposed to happen. They needed someone to fill Ali's spot in Elimination Chamber, and they just threw in one of the veterans who weren't booked for anything else.

But fans have been clamoring for a lot of the overlooked superstars to get a push, so when Kofi got on the main stage, he was instantly over. To his credit, Vince learned after Daniel Bryan to not get n the way when an organic push happens. He even used his history of burying those kinds of situations in the past as the storyline leading up to Mania. And he probably claimed that was his intention from day one and thought he was a genius for it.

But since Mania, Kofi's storylines have been really flat, and his promos haven't been super engaging. Now that he's a central character on both Raw and SmackDown, you can tell his promos are being way more scripted. He's still showing passion as he delivers them, but it's nothing like he was able to do before he was under Vince's microscope.

There's so many guys on the roster that are like Kofi and Dean Amrose, who have all the tools to be engaging characters if they just got a shot. Because they don't break any backstage rules to get those shits, Vince thinks they are lazy millennials, and doesn't understand they are just doing what they think is expected. If he'd just take some of the chains off people, nobody could touch WWE. It's going to take AEW proving the types of superstar Vince overlooks are actually the people who will sell tickets and merchandise to really make him wake up.

Same, and I really hope it's enough to prompt changes in WWE. If they get their shit together, everyone wins. It's just more quality wrestling all around.

My only gripe with AEW so far is they are still using the oldschool PPV model. Hopefully they can get some better digital partners so we don't have to shell out $60 for every event. It's hard to compete with WWE Network when it comes to those costs.

Thoughts after the Super Showdown's main event?

We should have seen that coming....

I haven't been watching WWE since CM Punk left, but for some reason I wanted to see that main event.

Just to regret it.

1. Badly handled tombstone that could end for Goldberg like it did for Steve Austin in his match against Owen Hart;
2. Terribly botched jackhammer - I read that Undertaker was mad about it backstage after the match since Goldberg could simply break his neck;
3. Just awfully botched tombstone reversal... that just could not work. I remember Undertaker vs HHH when Hunter performed a tombstone without any problems, Goldberg even had a problem to lift Taker properly...

And the finale when Undie had a look of a guy that just wants to end this shit and finished it with a half-lifted chokeslam...

It partially reminded me the ending of the infamous Sting vs Jeff Hardy match in TNA.

In botch situations Undertaker and Sting proved to be "strategically" thinking of what to do with the match if something starts to go wrong.

I'm not sure if the bleeding was scripted or it was partially another botch. Goldberg hitting the corner after Undertaker evaded reminded me a similar situation in Goldberg's match against Diamond Dallas Page in WCW.

I also had a feeling that Goldberg was suffering from a legitimate concussion that had to happen during the match-or he is simply not fit enough to handle a full-time match anymore, despite still being in a very good shape. Or both. No wonder that all his matches after return were squash ones.

But for fuck's sake... Undertaker and Goldberg are in their 50s already. They should think about retirement. This match only shown that their best in-ring time is obviously over. Also booking such matches by the "creative" team of the WWE just adds very unnecessary accents to the careers of both wrestlers. Especially Goldberg's.

Or maybe Vince is simply so desperate already with the ratings of both Raw and Smackdown going down and with a possible war with AEW around the corner. Back in the 90s Ted Turner's involvement in wrestling once almost did put WWF out of business...

You have to understand that the Saudis are stuck in the past, just like Vince. They are the ones asking for these oldtimers to show up. Its why you had this main event, and an out-of-nowhere HHH/Orton feud. They want to experience that Attitude Era in real life because they missed it the first time. And their favorite wrestlers are the big alpha male types that Vince can't get beyond.

Its the one show every year Vince can book himself, and that crowd will love it. He doesn't even need to pretend he supports women's wrestling there either.

I don't really mind that these Saudi shows exist, but WWE needs to quit selling them like they are actual PPVs when they are just high end house shows.

So they demanded RKO! Out of nowhere!? :-D

I wasn't following this, I only sometimes watch some reports on YouTube, but as for this feud they could have build it in a more intelligent way, like putting some post-Evolution conflict in it, like reminding the HHH's betrayal on Orton years ago (if they wanted to bring back some older times) for example. Or creating a storyline in which Orton would state: "Batista failed to put you out of business, then I will".

I remember - when I was still watching WWE regularly - that it was used by CM Punk and/or Daniel Bryan that stated that only big wrestlers are being pushed.

Well, the 205 division just sucks. WWF/WWE was never capable to properly use the "cruiserweight" wrestlers - in opposite to WCW. I really enjoyed the matches of Ray Mysterio, Juventud Guerrera, Ultimo Dragon, Kidman and lots of other - mainly Mexican or Japanese high-flyers. Also the early X-Division in TNA was quite well-made in my opinion.

Interesting fact about it-did you notice? Just before Undertaker vs Goldberg WWE was presenting the main matches that are scheduled for Stomping Grounds and both moments when women's matches were presented caused a massive ovation from the crowd. So the typical Saudis actually WOULD like to see women's wrestling, but it won't happen for obvious reasons.

It has been widely noticed that a fan's post in which he urged WWE to let both wrestlers retire in peace has been liked by Undertaker's official account.

I agree. Goldberg looked so bad, they should of let Hulk Hogan fight Undertaker.

That is very true. A very limited amount of moves.

Taker was lucky and barely made it through. Time for him to hang it up.

Vince FEARS AEW

It will take the industry by storm

Hope to surely run into you at a future AEW event

RAW has been weak lately

I agree. I miss the days when Elias was a face and sang funny songs.

Yeah hopefully he will go to AEW soon

Yes, that was the Elias that I liked. Bring that gimmick back.

I know right. Nobody wants to do that. Waiting until he pulls the swerve on Shane, and becomes his old self.

Tonights show was a masterpiece

wow.

RAW has become really disappointing again. Getting tired of Divas attempting to take over the show. Now, would be the perfect time to give them their own show. Seth Rollins is not my favorite. Shane o Mac is still trying to take over. Is he really the Best in the World? All signs point to no.

I was really surprised tonight by a few of the matches. I know at least one of them will be reversed if not done again Monday night.

I would like to wrestle but sadly my school doesn’t offer it so I’m screwed.

resurrecting this thread I made 16 years ago. I signed up for WWE Network and immediately pulled up a RAW event where I was captured on camera. December 2003.

Let's "diversify" this thread a bit ;-)

Your impressions after the very first AEW Dynamite?

I admit that especially the female fight, Riho vs Nyla Rose kicked ass. And the main event obviously with the backstage brawl between Jon Moxley and Kenny Omega.

Also some new but well-known faces appeared: the former members of Impact Wrestling's 2nd generation LAX and jack Hager, who - in opposite to CM Punk - was recently also successful in MMA fights with 2 victories.

I was actually there at the event in D.C.!

I really enjoyed the Riho match. That was probably my favorite bout from the evening despite the fact that it probably lasted longer than it should've and that there appeared to be a few botches from both wrestlers.

MJF is the best heel in wrestling right now. Hands down. He was amazing in a live arena environment.

I really did like Jake Hager showing up. People keep shitting on it by saying that he wasn't a big deal as the WWE's Jack Swagger so why bother caring about him showing up in AEW, but I think that's so misguided. The dude looks huge compared to the other members of that roster so he could easily fit in as a "big man" and I have all of the confidence in the world that this company will give him a proper push that Vince McMahon never did. Fingers crossed he's paired with Jericho as his bodyguard or something.

Really solid debut episode. I'm eager to watch the next one. How was the commentary? I couldn't hear any of it when I was in the arena...

No way! Awesome! How many people were there in the arena? Complete sellout? What were the reactions?

Yeah, I noticed those botches, but actually it only made the match look more natural.

To be honest I never liked him for some reason. I mean I appreciate that he was a real wrestler before entering WWE, but... As for the AEW roster: yeah, they seem to be completely not investing in hiring any big guys. Guess we will see no chokeslams or jackknife powerbombs ;-) Thinking of who they could hire... Big Cass definitely NOT, there was another big one some time ago (actually few years ago) in the NXT, but he was also a failure. Thinking back about the WWE... I always thought that Mason Ryan did not get enough push. As for the new ones: maybe Babatunde Aiyegbusi? That giant that appeared during Greatest Royal Rumble? Or maybe Jon Moxley could bring some old pals from CZW?

TBH: I never actually cared about the commentary, focusing only on matches and storylines.

I only watched highlights of the finale, but the Web says, that it was AEWsome! ;-) Did they censor the chants while broadcasting?

X-Pac's comment says all: "how the hell do you get DQ'd in a Hell in a frickin' Cell?!"

The new Bray Wyatt's gimmick looks strong, I only hope they won't fuck it up. Generally he should receive more push that he actually gets.

Besides the no-contest ending - I actually liked it. Quite creepy and... a bit gore ;-) They definitely ended the PG era.

Like it is being said on TV, in other news: there is a rumor that Hulk Hogan just "can't live with the fact that his last match took place in TNA" and asked Vince for one more retirement match that would happen after his next surgery...

I would be okay with this. I have been saying Hulk Hogan should wrestle again for many years.

My predictions for Crown Jewel

Brock Leanar (WWE championship match)

Braun Strowman

Bray Wyatt (Universal championship falls count anywhere match)

Team Hogan

The Viking Raiders

Cesar

20 Man battle royal for united states championship shot: picking a last minute entry

AJ Styles (United states championship match)

Anybody following the background of the story of WWE wrestlers being unable to return from Crown Jewel?

When business and politics collide people are being held... hostage ;-)

I think it's a non-story, the only corroborating evidence is a video shot by a spanish announcer and then passed around on the dirt sheets. If Americans were held hostage in Saudi Arabia, Trump would have said something about it by now.

Guys, whaddya think about the AEW Full Gear? For me both final matches kicked asses, although MJF's heel turn was predictable.

Definitely Jon Moxley vs Kenny Omega was the best. And judging from Jon's reactions he seemed to be happy to finally be able to perform in a more CZfuckinW style. I was only curious if there will be a moment when light tubes will come in ;-) Anyway it was probably the most hardcore match TNT has ever broadcasted - if they will be showing it after the PPV. But despite the amount of weapons used and even that vertical suplex on barbed wire the match wasn't that bloody after all, so these guys played safe ;-)

I am only curious - as for the second match - how will they build the further storyline to eventually enable Cody to become the #1 contender again? Because the bench of possible future champions seems a bit short right now. Of course both Jon Moxley and Kenny Omega will probably be considered, but who else? Dustin Rhodes? MJF? maybe Pentagon Jr? Hiring him was definitely a good move. Maybe some push for Christopher Daniels? It would be also good to see Jimmy Havoc promoted more, this guy has a potential. But so far that's all. Oh, of course Jake Hager, but he will not come into play as long as Chris Jericho will be le Champion and the Inner Circle will remain a monolith.

CM Punk showed up on FOX Backstage... I mean WWE Backstage on FOX, but Wrestlelamia's video regarding caused me to think about few things in the context of WWE - AEW relations.

I mean... is it really about the competition?

There is that conspiracy theory that those 2 companies are secretly working together... First thing I noticed was the fact that when DDP appeared to be the 3rd man alongside Dustin Rhodes and MJF to aid Cody he did not enter using his "Self Hi Five" Nirvana entrance music that he was using in WCW (on TNT) and TNA, but with the modified version of "Yo, it's me, it's DDP" that he used only in WWE. During the Cody vs Jericho match one of the commentators named one of the moves a "rock bottom". And the last but not least or rather most important: the upcoming Jericho cruise ship event that will be held under AEW brand: the announced special guests will be Kevin Nash and Ric Flair (both signed with WWE under the legends' program), Booker T (still signed to WWE) and Scott Hall that is stil occasionally appearing on WWE events. So... will they be released from their contracts or maybe WWE is not considering AEW as a such strong competition? I remember that at the peak of TNA it would be impossible for a wrestler or a legend to appear on both WWE and TNA shows.